MTB Tech Rumors and Innovation

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whitesq
Posts
32
Joined
8/1/2014
Location
FC, CO US
Fantasy
2727th
8/15/2024 8:20am
The explanation I got on what the numbers correlate to with RockShox tunes are pounds of force generated on a dyno. For example R23 would translate...

The explanation I got on what the numbers correlate to with RockShox tunes are pounds of force generated on a dyno. For example R23 would translate into 230lbs of force and C43 would be 430lbs of force when measured at a constant input velocity.

Dave_Camp wrote:
Correct.  I helped lay out the new tune names etc.  We had the issue where a M tune on a Super Deluxe did not match the...

Correct.  I helped lay out the new tune names etc.  We had the issue where a M tune on a Super Deluxe did not match the M tune on a Deluxe and that did not match the M tune on VIVID...  Also- we had a shock with extra L1, L2, L3 and L4 tunes (in addition to normal L, M and H), they were not spaced evenly and no one could remember if L1 was lighter or heavier than a L2 tune.  So we went to numbers that meant something on the dyno.

We wanted OEMs to be able to test on one shock model (and dial in their tunes), then be able to spec by price up/down the range without having to translate tunes for them on the various different models and price points.  Also the ability to do a custom named C36 tune was there- and it makes sense and easy for everyone to know C36 is a tiny bit lighter than a C37.

So a C37 VIVID (with Comp adjustments in the middle settings) should very closely ride like a C37 Deluxe.  Of course a VIVID has extra features and adjustments and probably works a bit better, but the general idea was if you pick the tune on one shock- the same tune on other models will work nicely (provided the air springs are also close to equivalent).

 

Similar thing on Rebound- but wanted to get away from the names as we thought some PMs were being influenced by the names (progressive, linear, digressive).  Also again having the ability to make a new tune based on force and curve shape and have a logical name that makes some sense.

 

@Dave_Camp Just curious, at what velocity are those number generated?

1
jonkranked
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Norristown, PA US
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824th
8/15/2024 8:45am
thegromit wrote:
 MSRP-----------$$$$$$860
Screenshot 2024-08-15 at 9.16.17%E2%80%AFAM.png?VersionId=u6sllHCd qOl5C72hDJ1ikdGy

 

MSRP-----------$$$$$$860

where'd you see the MSRP?

Nobble
Posts
61
Joined
9/24/2010
Location
Santa Cruz, CA US
8/15/2024 9:01am Edited Date/Time 8/15/2024 9:01am
thegromit wrote:
 MSRP-----------$$$$$$860
Screenshot 2024-08-15 at 9.16.17%E2%80%AFAM.png?VersionId=u6sllHCd qOl5C72hDJ1ikdGy

 

MSRP-----------$$$$$$860

jonkranked wrote:

where'd you see the MSRP?

It probably shows pricing if you log in with a shop account.

2
kperras
Posts
32
Joined
12/19/2012
Location
CA
Fantasy
3801st
8/15/2024 9:25am

Great read. Thanks for the doing the work for us, and damn you for making me think about getting an o-chain...

5
8/15/2024 9:51am
Nobble wrote:

Has anyone heard about when a new Sentinel/Scout might be dropping? They’ve been on clearance for what seems like forever.

Everything I've heard points to them trying to generate cash/move overstock in a terrible bike market. The 'clearance' pricing is not about a new model coming out, but rather trying to generate cash flow. 

2
8/15/2024 10:03am
jonkranked wrote:
on the other site, they posted an interview with Bryn Atkinson and this quote from Shimano product manager for mtb drivetrain Nick Murdick: "I actually think...

on the other site, they posted an interview with Bryn Atkinson and this quote from Shimano product manager for mtb drivetrain Nick Murdick:

 

"I actually think that probably most mountain bikers don't want electronic shifting on their bike today. And I think that making a solid XT mechanical group is one of the most important things for us to get right in the coming years."

also basically confirmed that new saint is still in the works. 

Haha, no surprise the Shimano (who's electronic shift system is way off the back in 2024) PM would say that on a podcast about (to hype) Shimano products.  
Similar to the famous quote by Steve Balmer that iPhones wouldn't be successful in business because they didn't have a physical keyboard.  

Shimano's electronic MTB shifting is currently dead in the water for mountain bikes. It has virtually 0% spec on OEM builds. With SRAM introducing the lower cost "S" series wireless Transmission kit, you will see a ton of it flooding OEM builds in 2025 and beyond. By 2026, I wouldn't be surprised if 30% of OEM MTBs (with price points over $3,000) are SRAM wireless Transmission. 

4
5
jalopyj
Posts
14
Joined
10/23/2023
Location
Concord, CA US
8/15/2024 10:30am
sspomer wrote:
it's here-  @TEAMROBOT's ochain vs no chain feature is live. please discuss it on that review page instead of clogging up tech rumors. charlie...

it's here-  @TEAMROBOT's ochain vs no chain feature is live. please discuss it on that review page instead of clogging up tech rumors. charlie rules!

https://www.vitalmtb.com/features/can-pedal-kickback-denier-see-light

CharlieA 0.jpg?VersionId=fG2QI27tm

charlie's alternative seinfeld-inspired thumbnail

OchainA3 1.jpg?VersionId=jd537NYh4WhGoixSs5bj1EoaipmZ4S

Lots of great talking points. I’ve been running an ochain and also have felt a noticeable improvement especially under braking. It makes me wonder how much influence our current drivetrain system (chain, derailleur, clutch) has on  suspension performance and if gearbox bikes also suffer from “chain growth” and pedal kickback. 

7
Nobble
Posts
61
Joined
9/24/2010
Location
Santa Cruz, CA US
8/15/2024 11:01am
Nobble wrote:

Has anyone heard about when a new Sentinel/Scout might be dropping? They’ve been on clearance for what seems like forever.

Everything I've heard points to them trying to generate cash/move overstock in a terrible bike market. The 'clearance' pricing is not about a new model coming...

Everything I've heard points to them trying to generate cash/move overstock in a terrible bike market. The 'clearance' pricing is not about a new model coming out, but rather trying to generate cash flow. 

That would make sense if they had bikes, but a lot of things are sold out. Scouts have been sold out in almost every configuration for months.

Also the carbon Sentinel still isn’t UDH. I thought we were gonna get an update this summer for sure.

2
saskskier
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CA
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8/15/2024 11:33am

I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

p5pb27086158

20
vermontana
Posts
1
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4/22/2024
Location
Leadville, CO US
8/15/2024 11:35am
Nobble wrote:

Has anyone heard about when a new Sentinel/Scout might be dropping? They’ve been on clearance for what seems like forever.

My buddy stopped in at his local dealer looking at Smugglers and they mentioned September for new Sentinel. He heard UDH, same travel, slightly steeper STA and in-frame storage but no further details

4
8/15/2024 11:47am
jonkranked wrote:

after my latest build i'm considering making the jump to an electronic dropper... if the price is right.

amaranth wrote:
I feel you, routing a dropper can be painful. That being said...I sold my AXS dropper and went with one up v3. Can get a 210...

I feel you, routing a dropper can be painful. That being said...I sold my AXS dropper and went with one up v3. Can get a 210 drop instead of the 175 max on the AXS, and a much lower stack height. 

jonkranked wrote:

i mean, it wasn't awful.  just a hassle. the thought of just slapping it in and GO certainly has an appeal. 

You could pay your LBS to do it and still have a bunch of money left over to spend on wheels/tires/suspension.

2
earleb
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Location
North Vancouver, BC CA
Fantasy
276th
8/15/2024 11:55am

There is a new DH bike still to drop this season. Everything isn't dried up just yet. 

6
wande001
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2
Joined
1/11/2022
Location
Bend, OR US
8/15/2024 12:15pm
saskskier wrote:
I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

p5pb27086158

Design kinda looks like it could be an evil, looks pretty sick

1
2
8/15/2024 12:22pm
saskskier wrote:
I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

p5pb27086158

wande001 wrote:

Design kinda looks like it could be an evil, looks pretty sick

Exactly what I thought at first. It does look great. 

1
jasbushey
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Location
Durango, CO US
Fantasy
2544th
8/15/2024 12:51pm
saskskier wrote:
I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

p5pb27086158

The headtube makes it look like an evil as other said.  Looks like a flip chip for mullet in that current configuration.  The Zeb combo makes me think a new Wreckoning or Insurgent, or they combined both into a singular platform? 

1
8/15/2024 12:53pm
sspomer wrote:
it's here-  @TEAMROBOT's ochain vs no chain feature is live. please discuss it on that review page instead of clogging up tech rumors. charlie...

it's here-  @TEAMROBOT's ochain vs no chain feature is live. please discuss it on that review page instead of clogging up tech rumors. charlie rules!

https://www.vitalmtb.com/features/can-pedal-kickback-denier-see-light

CharlieA 0.jpg?VersionId=fG2QI27tm

charlie's alternative seinfeld-inspired thumbnail

OchainA3 1.jpg?VersionId=jd537NYh4WhGoixSs5bj1EoaipmZ4S

Everyone complaining about this thread getting derailed, go read this and comment on it there so all the discussion is actually in a on-topic spot

4
NicoZesty96
Posts
326
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8/21/2014
Location
portogruaro, VE IT
8/15/2024 12:59pm
saskskier wrote:
I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

p5pb27086158

jasbushey wrote:
The headtube makes it look like an evil as other said.  Looks like a flip chip for mullet in that current configuration.  The Zeb combo makes...

The headtube makes it look like an evil as other said.  Looks like a flip chip for mullet in that current configuration.  The Zeb combo makes me think a new Wreckoning or Insurgent, or they combined both into a singular platform? 

naah evil without delta? can't be, it’s the best thing about the bikes!

5
gbcoke
Posts
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Joined
1/6/2016
Location
US
8/15/2024 1:06pm Edited Date/Time 8/15/2024 1:08pm

Can't see Evil dropping Delta ,it really works well and let them be different .

Maybe a new Intense ?

Or something Euro since the rear brake seems like an Intend .

4
8/15/2024 1:11pm
earleb wrote:

There is a new DH bike still to drop this season. Everything isn't dried up just yet. 

Big legged bird that returns from the ashes? 

8
1
wande001
Posts
2
Joined
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Location
Bend, OR US
8/15/2024 1:15pm
gbcoke wrote:
Can't see Evil dropping Delta ,it really works well and let them be different .Maybe a new Intense ?Or something Euro since the rear brake seems...

Can't see Evil dropping Delta ,it really works well and let them be different .

Maybe a new Intense ?

Or something Euro since the rear brake seems like an Intend .

Would be surprised if they went away front Delta, but the linkage does give me Dave Weagle vibes, maybe delta v2?

2
8/15/2024 1:22pm
saskskier wrote:
I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

p5pb27086158

Honestly if I had to guess I'd guess it's a Revel. The angled lower link seems more like most CBF implementations than DW-Link, and the styling has fewer curves than Evil's (current) language. Either way, I'm disappointed in the lack of any in- or even on-frame storage, but it could just be a prototype given the CNC'd links.

5
8/15/2024 1:41pm
saskskier wrote:
I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

p5pb27086158

Honestly if I had to guess I'd guess it's a Revel. The angled lower link seems more like most CBF implementations than DW-Link, and the styling...

Honestly if I had to guess I'd guess it's a Revel. The angled lower link seems more like most CBF implementations than DW-Link, and the styling has fewer curves than Evil's (current) language. Either way, I'm disappointed in the lack of any in- or even on-frame storage, but it could just be a prototype given the CNC'd links.

I doubt its a CBF; the upper link will rise up a little and then "switch" directions, headed back down for the last half (at least) of travel. Thats classic DW movement. 

2
2
8/15/2024 1:44pm Edited Date/Time 8/15/2024 1:44pm
saskskier wrote:
I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

I'll be that guy and repost from the other site. Anyone have any idea what this is?

p5pb27086158

Can I speculate about the shocks tune on this frame? I kid, I kid :-)

6
bnsleit
Posts
51
Joined
9/27/2021
Location
Missoula, MT US
8/15/2024 2:10pm

Thoughts on this? 

https://www.instagram.com/loopsdrive/

Imagine if behind your cassette was a 42 tooth cog, and thats where the "pawls" engage instead of in the hub. 

nifty idea but I'd shy away because it would be an additional exposed component that needs cleaned and is susceptible to a stick getting in there and putting me over the bars, I have enough trouble with my drivetrain as-is. a cover could help convince me to try it but at that point we're just getting back closer to a traditional freehub?

2
1
bnsleit
Posts
51
Joined
9/27/2021
Location
Missoula, MT US
8/15/2024 2:14pm
earleb wrote:

There is a new DH bike still to drop this season. Everything isn't dried up just yet. 

tarekfahmy wrote:

Big legged bird that returns from the ashes? 

that or the gambler, I'd gamble

1

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