Disclaimer: I grew up racing downhill, and like most folks on Vital, I prefer gravity-focused bikes/riding. I pedal, but usually as a means to access descents, and I'm typically on 140mm+ bikes. Showing up at an XC press camp with flat pedals and a trail helmet was pretty comical. I figured I'd like the EVO more since I enjoy pushing bikes on descents. But turns out, I really underestimated what XC bikes are capable of, as the Epic blew my doors off. It was fun to check out a bike that's a bit outside our wheelhouse, and it's wild how capable small travel bikes have become.
Also Flight Attendant is still as sick as the first time I rode it two years ago. Don't hate the player, hate the game
Bryson Martin also posted about the DVO Jade X and Topaz "Prime" versions on Instagram the other day, and said to preorder on the DVO website, but there is nothing about those shocks on their website yet.
I have an idea. I suppose it could also go in the standards thread. But it's one I'd like to create, not get rid of. Here it goes...
What if we could have standardized hydraulic brake line fittings? (I would vote for the SRAM screw on style.) with so many frame manufactures going to internal routing it's often a real pain to fish hoses through. Santa Cruz is way ahead of the curve with the tube in frame approach. But why not take things a step further and have brake lines integrated into the frame? Plumb the lever into the frame near the head tube with a short hose and the caliper into the chain stay with another. the hose inside the frame would be protected from damage.
oh man, BIG trash that top tube Harley bike neo-throwback^^^^WE DONE WITH THE FRENCH
New Tech that matters more than anything--Helmets!;
6D Helmets dropping a light-weight fullface that will have 6D's 'suspension for your head' (omni-directional rubber dampers suspended between shell-in-shell dual density EPS foam liners). These guys make the safest/most robust MTB helmet in the industry...moto too.
I actually slowed down on rippin' fast bikes if it required a fullface because riding without a 6D helmet legitimately makes me immensely more cautious. The 6D fullface is around 1,300+ grams and taking a lower-velocity impact on such a large helmet mass could actually increase likelihood of head-trauma. Those 'lower velocity' impacts are typically best mitigated with half-shell trail helmets that weigh 3-500 grams. The updated 6D half-shell ATB-2T is really pushing the boundaries in what's possible with safely reducing angular acceleration/damping compressive forces during a strike to your head...be it slow, medium or fast--but I'm holdin out on hittin hard till I can run a chin bar, under 900g and I won't settle for anything less than 6D. Shoutout Ryan Radriguez for waking my ass up to the truth.
The new 6D fullface 'enduro' helmet is supposedly around the ~750g mark.
Current ATB-2T showing the 'helmet in helmet' with damper sheet moulded in between.;
oh man, BIG trash that top tube Harley bike neo-throwback^^^^WE DONE WITH THE FRENCH
New Tech that matters more than anything--Helmets!;
6D Helmets dropping a...
oh man, BIG trash that top tube Harley bike neo-throwback^^^^WE DONE WITH THE FRENCH
New Tech that matters more than anything--Helmets!;
6D Helmets dropping a light-weight fullface that will have 6D's 'suspension for your head' (omni-directional rubber dampers suspended between shell-in-shell dual density EPS foam liners). These guys make the safest/most robust MTB helmet in the industry...moto too.
I actually slowed down on rippin' fast bikes if it required a fullface because riding without a 6D helmet legitimately makes me immensely more cautious. The 6D fullface is around 1,300+ grams and taking a lower-velocity impact on such a large helmet mass could actually increase likelihood of head-trauma. Those 'lower velocity' impacts are typically best mitigated with half-shell trail helmets that weigh 3-500 grams. The updated 6D half-shell ATB-2T is really pushing the boundaries in what's possible with safely reducing angular acceleration/damping compressive forces during a strike to your head...be it slow, medium or fast--but I'm holdin out on hittin hard till I can run a chin bar, under 900g and I won't settle for anything less than 6D. Shoutout Ryan Radriguez for waking my ass up to the truth.
The new 6D fullface 'enduro' helmet is supposedly around the ~750g mark.
Current ATB-2T showing the 'helmet in helmet' with damper sheet moulded in between.;
The moto tech 6D
The whole lighter helmets leading to lessened force on impact was never something I thought about before listening to a podcast (I think it was P
with the Kali Protectives CEO a while back. It makes a lot of sense when you think about it though, not to mention I hate riding in heavy full faces. I don't know if it's just me but I feel like my center of gravity is thrown off, especially in large berms. Keeping this in mind, I picked up a brand new POC Otocon Race for $200 CAD off the PB buysell and was really, really impressed with the weight. Even with a generous visor, MIPS, and a boa system it's coming in at 750 grams in a medium. I'm not super familiar with 6-D as a company or technology but I wonder if it has the potential to be the next MIPS and become a feature in other brands offerings. I will say that if what they're claiming is accurate, 750 grams for the enduro model might be worth the swap for me as long as it doesn't come out looking like its part of the Ruroc gene pool
Edit- Might be worth sharing this in the MTB head injuries thread as well
Mips is comparative to a carbon Huffy mountain bike sold at Walmart vs. what 6D Helmets has goin on. Once you get their half-shell ATB-2T in your hands its a night and day difference. Even the 'pretty good' 360* disc technology Leatt has implement or the LDL rubber pivots that Kali innovated--all of them are so obviously lacking in velocity reduction if you were to smash the ever living shit out of your head. You can just see it, its not hard to tell.
This is bigger than capitalism or 'favoritism'. This new 6D fullface is going to save/protect so many of our community's brain cells, aka the most important part of the bike. Ditch the mips.
They're dropping @Sea Otter, be on the lookout. I've been awaiting this for the past two years (+all boomers who klunked their way through the 70's/80's/90's/2000's with non-existent helmet technology)
I have an idea. I suppose it could also go in the standards thread. But it's one I'd like to create, not get rid of. Here...
I have an idea. I suppose it could also go in the standards thread. But it's one I'd like to create, not get rid of. Here it goes...
What if we could have standardized hydraulic brake line fittings? (I would vote for the SRAM screw on style.) with so many frame manufactures going to internal routing it's often a real pain to fish hoses through. Santa Cruz is way ahead of the curve with the tube in frame approach. But why not take things a step further and have brake lines integrated into the frame? Plumb the lever into the frame near the head tube with a short hose and the caliper into the chain stay with another. the hose inside the frame would be protected from damage.
There's the problem of different oils... Unless we just all agree on using DOT, but don't see that happening...
What I would like to see is removable hardware on the hoses so I don't have to cut the hose or throw away the olive every time the hose needs to come out of the bike. Or, you know, not have internal routing...
There's the problem of different oils... Unless we just all agree on using DOT, but don't see that happening...
What I would like to see is...
There's the problem of different oils... Unless we just all agree on using DOT, but don't see that happening...
What I would like to see is removable hardware on the hoses so I don't have to cut the hose or throw away the olive every time the hose needs to come out of the bike. Or, you know, not have internal routing...
I wish I could upvote more on this. I wish more brands would forgo internal routing.
Didn't the Formula Cura's have a hose decouple feature?
It was the R1, RO, The One generation of brakes that had this. Sram also had the connectamajig for both droppers and brakes, but it's not relevant with a lot of internally routed frames that have holes that are just the right size for the hose and nothing else, not even the olive. Meaning you have to take (cut) off the olive to take off the nut and rubber boot anyway. That's my gripe. With Sram brakes at least you have the screw in olive that can be removed without cutting the hose.
Apparently the Lewis brakes have a completely rebuildable hose end fittings that don't require cutting the hose. It's quite possible they are a bit more chunky though...
It was the R1, RO, The One generation of brakes that had this. Sram also had the connectamajig for both droppers and brakes, but it's not...
It was the R1, RO, The One generation of brakes that had this. Sram also had the connectamajig for both droppers and brakes, but it's not relevant with a lot of internally routed frames that have holes that are just the right size for the hose and nothing else, not even the olive. Meaning you have to take (cut) off the olive to take off the nut and rubber boot anyway. That's my gripe. With Sram brakes at least you have the screw in olive that can be removed without cutting the hose.
Apparently the Lewis brakes have a completely rebuildable hose end fittings that don't require cutting the hose. It's quite possible they are a bit more chunky though...
Trickstuff’s hose ends are fully rebuildable, the barb screws into the hose and the outer part of the fitting at the same time. Since the Lewis brake is a straight up copy, I guess they went all in and copied every detail…
There's the problem of different oils... Unless we just all agree on using DOT, but don't see that happening...
What I would like to see is...
There's the problem of different oils... Unless we just all agree on using DOT, but don't see that happening...
What I would like to see is removable hardware on the hoses so I don't have to cut the hose or throw away the olive every time the hose needs to come out of the bike. Or, you know, not have internal routing...
I wish I could upvote more on this. I wish more brands would forgo internal routing.
Didn't the Formula Cura's have a hose decouple feature?
Recently took my Madonna apart completely. just took off the brakes and drivetrain and screwed them back on afterwards, no bleeding or adjustments necessary. I love it.
It was the R1, RO, The One generation of brakes that had this. Sram also had the connectamajig for both droppers and brakes, but it's not...
It was the R1, RO, The One generation of brakes that had this. Sram also had the connectamajig for both droppers and brakes, but it's not relevant with a lot of internally routed frames that have holes that are just the right size for the hose and nothing else, not even the olive. Meaning you have to take (cut) off the olive to take off the nut and rubber boot anyway. That's my gripe. With Sram brakes at least you have the screw in olive that can be removed without cutting the hose.
Apparently the Lewis brakes have a completely rebuildable hose end fittings that don't require cutting the hose. It's quite possible they are a bit more chunky though...
Cura brakes still have a detachable hose on the caliper, speedlock.
While I haven't seen anything in person or on paper, the rumors I've heard is that if there's a Slash-e, it'll be a TQ motor like...
While I haven't seen anything in person or on paper, the rumors I've heard is that if there's a Slash-e, it'll be a TQ motor like the EX-e and the Rail will get a revamp to become a real bike at some point after they get rid of all the duds they have now. Allegedly, the HP infrastructure wouldn't be able to handle a full power motor without a ton of weight added, but we'll see.
Why wouldn’t HP be compatible with a full power motor? RM does it, although their concept is a bit different with powering exactly the idler, but Norco are soon releasing the HP Range VLT, Bird had their e-bike through prototyping with a regular HP-layout but still not available, not sure what happened. However, Pyga’s HP e-bike is available but not so much marketed, so it’s not as famous as other brands’ options. But the first media people to have swung a leg over it have been raving about its performance. And it’s a regular HP horst-link with a EP8/EP801. What do you think might happen to the idler with a full power motor - be destroyed or something?
It's not really that it's not compatible, the power of e-bikes is the main issue. They wear out the drivetrains really fast as is, idlers will get a beating if not designed correctly in case of a high pivot design. That or a non-concentric layout of the motor would also be a solution.
Bird (Ethic) has problems sourcing motors and/or systems for their bikes, nobody wants to sell them the low quantities that they need except for Shimano. But they didn't want to have the failure rates in the field they were seeing with testing Shimano units - can't remember what it was, it was either 25 or 75 % of the tested units failing. Big difference between the two numbers, for sure, but in either case it's crazy high for a mass produced product even at 25 %. Even 2,5 % could be quite high for a small direct sales brand.
It was the R1, RO, The One generation of brakes that had this. Sram also had the connectamajig for both droppers and brakes, but it's not...
It was the R1, RO, The One generation of brakes that had this. Sram also had the connectamajig for both droppers and brakes, but it's not relevant with a lot of internally routed frames that have holes that are just the right size for the hose and nothing else, not even the olive. Meaning you have to take (cut) off the olive to take off the nut and rubber boot anyway. That's my gripe. With Sram brakes at least you have the screw in olive that can be removed without cutting the hose.
Apparently the Lewis brakes have a completely rebuildable hose end fittings that don't require cutting the hose. It's quite possible they are a bit more chunky though...
Uber bike brake hose kits use reusable fittings and the are thinner than other braided options so should work with internal routing just fine.
should i post the new fox dampers again? since no one seems to have seen it before fox pulled some strings to get it removed.
new epic 8 and epic 8 evo are out. flight attendant, too. features on our homepage.
looks like epics can ship directly to home, too. that's new for bikes at specialized isn't it?
Here are links to new Epics and XC Flight Attendant:
https://www.vitalmtb.com/product/guide/bikes/specialized/epic-evo-48446…
https://www.vitalmtb.com/news/press-release/rockshoxs-xc-flight-attenda…
Disclaimer: I grew up racing downhill, and like most folks on Vital, I prefer gravity-focused bikes/riding. I pedal, but usually as a means to access descents, and I'm typically on 140mm+ bikes. Showing up at an XC press camp with flat pedals and a trail helmet was pretty comical. I figured I'd like the EVO more since I enjoy pushing bikes on descents. But turns out, I really underestimated what XC bikes are capable of, as the Epic blew my doors off. It was fun to check out a bike that's a bit outside our wheelhouse, and it's wild how capable small travel bikes have become.
Also Flight Attendant is still as sick as the first time I rode it two years ago. Don't hate the player, hate the game
Might be new for higher-end bikes, but you've been able to buy lower-end stuff (i.e. kids bikes) direct to home for a number of years in the US.
https://dvosuspension.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/02/DVO-Jade-X-WP-Setup_Guide_Dec5_2023.pdf So I dont know if this has been shown before. But WP is trying their hand at MTB suspension. Or going through DVO to do it (or Suntour?). Regardless I thought it was interesting that this manual comes from DVOs website.
That would be sweet, I saw it but never took a SS
WP already did the Boltron for Magura.
A real shame they marketed it as ebike only.
There was one in the Magura UK office… i’d love to have tried it as it looked pretty decent.
WP partnered with DVO for some GasGas bikes.
Bryson Martin also posted about the DVO Jade X and Topaz "Prime" versions on Instagram the other day, and said to preorder on the DVO website, but there is nothing about those shocks on their website yet.
What 😍
Not specific but JUNE 2024
red zeb and charger 3.1
I have an idea. I suppose it could also go in the standards thread. But it's one I'd like to create, not get rid of. Here it goes...
What if we could have standardized hydraulic brake line fittings? (I would vote for the SRAM screw on style.) with so many frame manufactures going to internal routing it's often a real pain to fish hoses through. Santa Cruz is way ahead of the curve with the tube in frame approach. But why not take things a step further and have brake lines integrated into the frame? Plumb the lever into the frame near the head tube with a short hose and the caliper into the chain stay with another. the hose inside the frame would be protected from damage.
Do we have a precise date for the rm altitude
It's already available
Jokes aside they will receive a gentle reminder in the mail about the model name...
oh man, BIG trash that top tube Harley bike neo-throwback^^^^WE DONE WITH THE FRENCH
New Tech that matters more than anything--Helmets!;
6D Helmets dropping a light-weight fullface that will have 6D's 'suspension for your head' (omni-directional rubber dampers suspended between shell-in-shell dual density EPS foam liners). These guys make the safest/most robust MTB helmet in the industry...moto too.
I actually slowed down on rippin' fast bikes if it required a fullface because riding without a 6D helmet legitimately makes me immensely more cautious. The 6D fullface is around 1,300+ grams and taking a lower-velocity impact on such a large helmet mass could actually increase likelihood of head-trauma. Those 'lower velocity' impacts are typically best mitigated with half-shell trail helmets that weigh 3-500 grams. The updated 6D half-shell ATB-2T is really pushing the boundaries in what's possible with safely reducing angular acceleration/damping compressive forces during a strike to your head...be it slow, medium or fast--but I'm holdin out on hittin hard till I can run a chin bar, under 900g and I won't settle for anything less than 6D. Shoutout Ryan Radriguez for waking my ass up to the truth.
The new 6D fullface 'enduro' helmet is supposedly around the ~750g mark.
Current ATB-2T showing the 'helmet in helmet' with damper sheet moulded in between.;
The moto tech 6D
The whole lighter helmets leading to lessened force on impact was never something I thought about before listening to a podcast (I think it was P
with the Kali Protectives CEO a while back. It makes a lot of sense when you think about it though, not to mention I hate riding in heavy full faces. I don't know if it's just me but I feel like my center of gravity is thrown off, especially in large berms. Keeping this in mind, I picked up a brand new POC Otocon Race for $200 CAD off the PB buysell and was really, really impressed with the weight. Even with a generous visor, MIPS, and a boa system it's coming in at 750 grams in a medium. I'm not super familiar with 6-D as a company or technology but I wonder if it has the potential to be the next MIPS and become a feature in other brands offerings. I will say that if what they're claiming is accurate, 750 grams for the enduro model might be worth the swap for me as long as it doesn't come out looking like its part of the Ruroc gene pool
Edit- Might be worth sharing this in the MTB head injuries thread as well
Mips is comparative to a carbon Huffy mountain bike sold at Walmart vs. what 6D Helmets has goin on. Once you get their half-shell ATB-2T in your hands its a night and day difference. Even the 'pretty good' 360* disc technology Leatt has implement or the LDL rubber pivots that Kali innovated--all of them are so obviously lacking in velocity reduction if you were to smash the ever living shit out of your head. You can just see it, its not hard to tell.
This is bigger than capitalism or 'favoritism'. This new 6D fullface is going to save/protect so many of our community's brain cells, aka the most important part of the bike. Ditch the mips.
They're dropping @Sea Otter, be on the lookout. I've been awaiting this for the past two years (+all boomers who klunked their way through the 70's/80's/90's/2000's with non-existent helmet technology)
also; I posted up a super strong herbal nerve repair list in the helmet thread--https://www.vitalmtb.com/forums/The-Hub,2/Mountain-Biking-and-Head-Inju…
There's the problem of different oils... Unless we just all agree on using DOT, but don't see that happening...
What I would like to see is removable hardware on the hoses so I don't have to cut the hose or throw away the olive every time the hose needs to come out of the bike. Or, you know, not have internal routing...
I wish I could upvote more on this. I wish more brands would forgo internal routing.
Didn't the Formula Cura's have a hose decouple feature?
It was the R1, RO, The One generation of brakes that had this. Sram also had the connectamajig for both droppers and brakes, but it's not relevant with a lot of internally routed frames that have holes that are just the right size for the hose and nothing else, not even the olive. Meaning you have to take (cut) off the olive to take off the nut and rubber boot anyway. That's my gripe. With Sram brakes at least you have the screw in olive that can be removed without cutting the hose.
Apparently the Lewis brakes have a completely rebuildable hose end fittings that don't require cutting the hose. It's quite possible they are a bit more chunky though...
Trickstuff’s hose ends are fully rebuildable, the barb screws into the hose and the outer part of the fitting at the same time. Since the Lewis brake is a straight up copy, I guess they went all in and copied every detail…
Recently took my Madonna apart completely. just took off the brakes and drivetrain and screwed them back on afterwards, no bleeding or adjustments necessary. I love it.
Cura brakes still have a detachable hose on the caliper, speedlock.
There was a rumor a while ago about new enve wheels
anyone know anything?
Why wouldn’t HP be compatible with a full power motor? RM does it, although their concept is a bit different with powering exactly the idler, but Norco are soon releasing the HP Range VLT, Bird had their e-bike through prototyping with a regular HP-layout but still not available, not sure what happened. However, Pyga’s HP e-bike is available but not so much marketed, so it’s not as famous as other brands’ options. But the first media people to have swung a leg over it have been raving about its performance. And it’s a regular HP horst-link with a EP8/EP801. What do you think might happen to the idler with a full power motor - be destroyed or something?
It's not really that it's not compatible, the power of e-bikes is the main issue. They wear out the drivetrains really fast as is, idlers will get a beating if not designed correctly in case of a high pivot design. That or a non-concentric layout of the motor would also be a solution.
Bird (Ethic) has problems sourcing motors and/or systems for their bikes, nobody wants to sell them the low quantities that they need except for Shimano. But they didn't want to have the failure rates in the field they were seeing with testing Shimano units - can't remember what it was, it was either 25 or 75 % of the tested units failing. Big difference between the two numbers, for sure, but in either case it's crazy high for a mass produced product even at 25 %. Even 2,5 % could be quite high for a small direct sales brand.
Uber bike brake hose kits use reusable fittings and the are thinner than other braided options so should work with internal routing just fine.
Other color besides the green/black
When life hands you lemons...make juice!
Don't even get me started on the weak thumbs too
so we don't get sspomers hand slapped. all i know is what i saw. 4 dampers.
G - OG - 2 way adj
GSL - XC - 2 way adj - Fit4 replacement
GX - Trail/AM - 3 way adj w firm switch
GX2 - Gravity - 4 way adj - Looks like Grip2
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