Having previously owned the Gambler, I am quite bummed out if they are changing the linkage to a horst link, the linkage assisted single pivot pulley design they had, has always been one of my favourites aesthetically. Plus it rides like a plough, which is sick.
Given all the new horst link bikes, i'd say it's a matter of time when the split will become less of a split.
You have to remember all the fancy singlepivot and short dual link configurations are there just because of the FSR patent. Now that that's no longer active, you can also freely use horst link. And people are using it in droves, apparently.
Scott has been moving this way with the rest of their bikes for a while now. With the redesigns of the Spark and Genius it was probably just a matter of time.
This one's still a bit rough around the edges being mated to a stock Gambler front triangle, but it's cool to see a 'real' prototype getting race tested in full view.
**Interesting two-axis lower shock mount, I wonder if it is meant to minimize side loads on what appears to be a fairly long-stroke shock?
[img]https://p.vitalmtb.com/photos/forums/2018/03/25/6205/s1200_s1200_shox.jpg[/img]
Fox shock taped up ?
Fox shock taped up ?
Exactly what I was thinking. Notice the Kashima coat on the shaft and the overall design of the shock. So indeed we can confirm that it's not "because of BOS" (just why? and after all, does the team really care if this improve the bike's performance?). Interesting thing however is the little piece added on the lower mount of the shock? Is it used to lighten the constraints applied on the shock lower (especially the shaft)?
It's probably there to have the correct rocker design, needed for the desired suspension properties, without changing the front triangle design by raising the shock eyelet. It's easier to machine an extension piece.
Sure, the effective ETE does change, but it's probably a minimal change given how rough this prototype is. I wouldn't be surprised if the production frame lowers the chainstay pivot or raises it even more by using a pulley, like GT does.
Well mx is the closest thing to dh and pretty much all of them are using linkage activated single pivot suspension because after all those years of development people realized this is probably the best design for their needs.
Ofc dh and mx have different suspension requirements with pedaling efficiency probably being most noticeable but yeah, fsr seems to be taking the lead. There is still healthy competition though, all of dual links (vpp,dw,maestro,ks,...), sliders (yeti,polygon), and single pivots seem to be still quite interesting with high pivots but I'm pretty sure it will not die as long as Orange keeps making bikes :D
It's probably there to have the correct rocker design, needed for the desired suspension properties, without changing the front triangle design by raising the shock eyelet...
It's probably there to have the correct rocker design, needed for the desired suspension properties, without changing the front triangle design by raising the shock eyelet. It's easier to machine an extension piece.
Sure, the effective ETE does change, but it's probably a minimal change given how rough this prototype is. I wouldn't be surprised if the production frame lowers the chainstay pivot or raises it even more by using a pulley, like GT does.
That sure looks like test mule for a redesign of the suspension. I think they are just trying things that could improve the current platform. Maybe they will just stick to their current design if the tests are not concluding
Doubt it. FSR gives you much more freedom in regards to the pivot placement, making frame design easier (you can adapt to certain other constrains), as long as you know what, you are doing (the suspension platform is easier to design with a single pivot, you have one optimal line of pivot placements and that's it). So you have pivots in a completely different position (for instance behind the BB, like Spec usually does) and still get the desired antisquat and chain growth characteristics.
Besides that any fourbar linkage is much more tunable in regards to braking feedback compared to a single pivot (not true for designs with floating brake mounts).
And as mentioned, the antisquat characteristics, desired from any bike, are completely different to desired characteristics of a motorcycle. Plus a single swingarm design can be made strong enough on a motorcycle since weight is not as big of an issue, single pivot linkage actuation designs are optimal from the packaging point of view (rocket placement under the seat and behind the engine/over the gearbox), etc.
Scott has been moving this way with the rest of their bikes for a while now. With the redesigns of the Spark and Genius it was...
Scott has been moving this way with the rest of their bikes for a while now. With the redesigns of the Spark and Genius it was probably just a matter of time.
This one's still a bit rough around the edges being mated to a stock Gambler front triangle, but it's cool to see a 'real' prototype getting race tested in full view.
**Interesting two-axis lower shock mount, I wonder if it is meant to minimize side loads on what appears to be a fairly long-stroke shock?
maybe they just needed to be able to mount the lower eyelet higher up than the front triangle allows, due to where the rocker could attach and what they wanted out of the kinematics.
The GT has a higher lower pivot which requires the idler for proper pedaling. The Scott, like many other FSR designs has the lower pivot roughly in line with the chainring.
It's not exactly low on the Scott either, wouldn't be surprised if it's maybe 5 mm lower or something small like that. The Gambler is known for a relatively high pivot point for an idler-less single pivot bike.
Well i guess this yoke is there for one reason: Why did nobody see that they use a trunion mount shock (upper shock mount)? it's most probably a 225 x 75 or 225 x 70 shock wich is considerably shorter than a 241 x 76 and in order to compensate for the lost eye to eye length they put the yoke in there. Aswell it gives them the opportunity to play with the bb height and different shock configurations. seems like those trunion mount shocks open opportunities for different shock-placement wich can be quite interesting for an engineer.....
I think trunnion shocks are interesting since they facilitate very easy use of ball bearings in the frame or rocker mount of the shock, which then doesn't have any wear items like they did with bushings.
Look closely with the two different photo where we see the complete bikes with the rider. In the first one with Gaetan Vigé the wheels looks clearly 27,5 but the second with Brendan, the wheels looks like 29 and they have no stickers on.
Also the bike in the van use a Bos shock and not a Fox with stickers on like the photo with Brendan's bike.
Good point, I did miss that.
I think trunnion shocks are interesting since they facilitate very easy use of ball bearings in the frame or rocker...
Good point, I did miss that.
I think trunnion shocks are interesting since they facilitate very easy use of ball bearings in the frame or rocker mount of the shock, which then doesn't have any wear items like they did with bushings.
Also good points. I suppose they will figure it out. After all, there are loads of aluminium pivot axles and bolts and not many problems. At least i didn't have any yet on my Reign.
No idea what Vali says but there's a bit of footage of the Losinj World Cup track. I was skeptical after that first helmet cam but now I think the track is looking like its almost worthy of a World Cup. 3 weeks to go!
I just find out that one of those flying frenchmen in EWS, Youn Deniaud, is still a privateer! And he doesn't have enough money to do a full season yet. That kid is only 21 but boi, he can ride his bike!
Dylan, problem is just the urban finish, everything in between is one big gnarly rock garden.
And the track will probably get blown up after the practice.
It is short but I believe there will be enormous number of destroyed rims (hopefully not riders). And if it rains its gonna be a slaughterhouse, wet limestone offers 0 grip
Miranda Bike Parts announced their DH Factory Team
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MIRANDA, the Portuguese manufacturer of cranksets and bicycle drivetrain solutions shows its commitment to the development of the sport and takes a step into the top level of DH racing. The new Miranda Factory Team will take part in the UCI DH World Cup and at some stops of the IXS DH Cup.
After a successful 2017 as co-sponsor of the official EWS BH-Miranda Racing Team, Miranda will continue to support the enduro team although as being the title name sponsor in 2018. Alongside with enduro, boosting this new DH team makes sense for us because at Miranda we want to show our full trust in supporting racing as a way to develop the sport and help riders to progress. On the top of that, the UCI DH World Cup will serve as a premium testing field for our products.
The riders of the Miranda Factory Team will ride Trek Session bikes at the races and also Trek Slash bikes for training, all bikes equipped with Miranda cranksets, chainrings and bottom brackets.
At Miranda we are proud of our roots, so the natural path for our team was to gather the best Portuguese young DH riders. The Miranda Factory Team welcomes Vasco Bica, Tiago Ladeira, and the promising talent Gonçalo Bandeira. Vasco Bica and Tiago Ladeira already have some experience at international level, with top 40s for Vasco and some good results as Tiago placing 10th junior last season in Lourdes DH World Cup. While Vasco and Tiago will be focused on the 2018 UCI DH World Cup season, Gonçalo, being 15 y.o., enters a development program that will allow him to compete at the international IXS DH cup.
You have to remember all the fancy singlepivot and short dual link configurations are there just because of the FSR patent. Now that that's no longer active, you can also freely use horst link. And people are using it in droves, apparently.
There must be some reason for it...
Fox shock taped up ?
This one's still a bit rough around the edges being mated to a stock Gambler front triangle, but it's cool to see a 'real' prototype getting race tested in full view.
**Interesting two-axis lower shock mount, I wonder if it is meant to minimize side loads on what appears to be a fairly long-stroke shock?
Sure, the effective ETE does change, but it's probably a minimal change given how rough this prototype is. I wouldn't be surprised if the production frame lowers the chainstay pivot or raises it even more by using a pulley, like GT does.
Ofc dh and mx have different suspension requirements with pedaling efficiency probably being most noticeable but yeah, fsr seems to be taking the lead. There is still healthy competition though, all of dual links (vpp,dw,maestro,ks,...), sliders (yeti,polygon), and single pivots seem to be still quite interesting with high pivots but I'm pretty sure it will not die as long as Orange keeps making bikes :D
Besides that any fourbar linkage is much more tunable in regards to braking feedback compared to a single pivot (not true for designs with floating brake mounts).
And as mentioned, the antisquat characteristics, desired from any bike, are completely different to desired characteristics of a motorcycle. Plus a single swingarm design can be made strong enough on a motorcycle since weight is not as big of an issue, single pivot linkage actuation designs are optimal from the packaging point of view (rocket placement under the seat and behind the engine/over the gearbox), etc.
Different requirements, different results.
I think trunnion shocks are interesting since they facilitate very easy use of ball bearings in the frame or rocker mount of the shock, which then doesn't have any wear items like they did with bushings.
Also the bike in the van use a Bos shock and not a Fox with stickers on like the photo with Brendan's bike.
https://youtu.be/RuvTYWrmt5s?rel=0
A link of his kickstarter : https://www.leetchi.com/c/cagnotte-de-youn-27221309
And the track will probably get blown up after the practice.
It is short but I believe there will be enormous number of destroyed rims (hopefully not riders). And if it rains its gonna be a slaughterhouse, wet limestone offers 0 grip
-----------
MIRANDA, the Portuguese manufacturer of cranksets and bicycle drivetrain solutions shows its commitment to the development of the sport and takes a step into the top level of DH racing. The new Miranda Factory Team will take part in the UCI DH World Cup and at some stops of the IXS DH Cup.
After a successful 2017 as co-sponsor of the official EWS BH-Miranda Racing Team, Miranda will continue to support the enduro team although as being the title name sponsor in 2018. Alongside with enduro, boosting this new DH team makes sense for us because at Miranda we want to show our full trust in supporting racing as a way to develop the sport and help riders to progress. On the top of that, the UCI DH World Cup will serve as a premium testing field for our products.
The riders of the Miranda Factory Team will ride Trek Session bikes at the races and also Trek Slash bikes for training, all bikes equipped with Miranda cranksets, chainrings and bottom brackets.
At Miranda we are proud of our roots, so the natural path for our team was to gather the best Portuguese young DH riders. The Miranda Factory Team welcomes Vasco Bica, Tiago Ladeira, and the promising talent Gonçalo Bandeira. Vasco Bica and Tiago Ladeira already have some experience at international level, with top 40s for Vasco and some good results as Tiago placing 10th junior last season in Lourdes DH World Cup. While Vasco and Tiago will be focused on the 2018 UCI DH World Cup season, Gonçalo, being 15 y.o., enters a development program that will allow him to compete at the international IXS DH cup.
We are thrilled for the season to begin. Bring it on!
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See the full press release here - https://www.vitalmtb.com/news/press-release/Miranda-Bike-Parts-releases…
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