MTB Tech Rumors and Innovation

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NicoZesty96
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387
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8/21/2014
Location
portogruaro, VE IT
10/15/2024 1:12am
Slavid666 wrote:
Meh, delta link is just linkage ratio manipulation through the dual link system. It created a well crafted LR and progression that was better than most...

Meh, delta link is just linkage ratio manipulation through the dual link system. It created a well crafted LR and progression that was better than most when it came out. Lots of bikes have identical or similar to LR curves now a days. Otherwise it was a single pivot, with inherent design compromises that came from the pivot location. There is a reason his newer systems use dual links, being able to tailor the AS and AR separate from the wheel path, at least IMO as an mech engineer…

FWIW: I’ve never spoken to him, it’s just my opinion based on the design progression over the years.

meh, is what i feel when riding plenty of other bikes vs Evil, which, is not the best, and not the one everyone will like, of course, but nothing rides the same, for good or bad it does not matter, i'm aware it's just a linkage driven single pivot, but they've done a hell of a job with it, and to this day i still think it's great despite all the good stuff that came out in the recent years.

4
2
TimBud
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376
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GB
Fantasy
875th
10/15/2024 1:23am Edited Date/Time 10/15/2024 1:29am
Slavid666 wrote:
Meh, delta link is just linkage ratio manipulation through the dual link system. It created a well crafted LR and progression that was better than most...

Meh, delta link is just linkage ratio manipulation through the dual link system. It created a well crafted LR and progression that was better than most when it came out. Lots of bikes have identical or similar to LR curves now a days. Otherwise it was a single pivot, with inherent design compromises that came from the pivot location. There is a reason his newer systems use dual links, being able to tailor the AS and AR separate from the wheel path, at least IMO as an mech engineer…

FWIW: I’ve never spoken to him, it’s just my opinion based on the design progression over the years.

DW link came out way before the Delta Link which I’m pretty sure is exclusive to Evil.

Again referencing Page’s podcast Weagle says he can get the same kinematic and ride characteristics that he can with DW.

FYI he offered his latest design to the Atherton’s before Pivot took it up. 

Sounds like he has some cool things in the works too

8
boozed
Posts
307
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AU
10/15/2024 3:14am Edited Date/Time 10/15/2024 4:12am
Slavid666 wrote:
Meh, delta link is just linkage ratio manipulation through the dual link system. It created a well crafted LR and progression that was better than most...

Meh, delta link is just linkage ratio manipulation through the dual link system. It created a well crafted LR and progression that was better than most when it came out. Lots of bikes have identical or similar to LR curves now a days. Otherwise it was a single pivot, with inherent design compromises that came from the pivot location. There is a reason his newer systems use dual links, being able to tailor the AS and AR separate from the wheel path, at least IMO as an mech engineer…

FWIW: I’ve never spoken to him, it’s just my opinion based on the design progression over the years.

TimBud wrote:
DW link came out way before the Delta Link which I’m pretty sure is exclusive to Evil.Again referencing Page’s podcast Weagle says he can get the...

DW link came out way before the Delta Link which I’m pretty sure is exclusive to Evil.

Again referencing Page’s podcast Weagle says he can get the same kinematic and ride characteristics that he can with DW.

FYI he offered his latest design to the Atherton’s before Pivot took it up. 

Sounds like he has some cool things in the works too

The same kinematic, as in the same AS and AR?  Is that actually what he said?

1
10/15/2024 4:03am
I miss my red Imperial. It was a product of it's time. Evil heavily implied the latest blowout pricing wasn't a going out of business event, it...

I miss my red Imperial. It was a product of it's time. 

Evil heavily implied the latest blowout pricing wasn't a going out of business event, it was a clearing inventory for new models event. There was also a rumor of them testing some 'different' looking bikes about a year ago, so seems likely they'll have something more than a refresh to share. The last few generations have been pretty incremental improvements on a theme that is somewhat dated. 

A longer rear end, steeper seat tube angle, taller stack Offering would be right up my alley. 

The future of Superboost comments goes here:

I have a nice wheelset so I don’t care if the superboost stays honestly, although I hope they stick with the short chainstay at least on...

I have a nice wheelset so I don’t care if the superboost stays honestly, although I hope they stick with the short chainstay at least on small and medium sizes, perhaps with a chip to make it longer if people want to

And stick with delta. As that’s what makes Evil bikes awesome to ride 

Let see hopefully sooner than later 

Slavid666 wrote:
Meh, delta link is just linkage ratio manipulation through the dual link system. It created a well crafted LR and progression that was better than most...

Meh, delta link is just linkage ratio manipulation through the dual link system. It created a well crafted LR and progression that was better than most when it came out. Lots of bikes have identical or similar to LR curves now a days. Otherwise it was a single pivot, with inherent design compromises that came from the pivot location. There is a reason his newer systems use dual links, being able to tailor the AS and AR separate from the wheel path, at least IMO as an mech engineer…

FWIW: I’ve never spoken to him, it’s just my opinion based on the design progression over the years.

AS and AR can be tuned with a single pivot, either use a split pivot like Trek, or use an idler pulley and a floating brake mount. Using those you can achieve pretty much any AR and AS levels and curves. Now this is a hot take but I feel like we are nearing the end of the low AR BS trend as people will realise that it actually doesn't do anything positive for 98% of the riders out there, while high AR make a bike calmer in sketchy situations. If/When this happen, single pivot will definitely get a second look as they allow good AR levels without resorting to crazy high AS levels (Gambler, Summum for example). 

4
MrSafeT
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Location
Galloway, OH US
10/15/2024 6:12am Edited Date/Time 10/15/2024 6:13am
I have a nice wheelset so I don’t care if the superboost stays honestly, although I hope they stick with the short chainstay at least on...

I have a nice wheelset so I don’t care if the superboost stays honestly, although I hope they stick with the short chainstay at least on small and medium sizes, perhaps with a chip to make it longer if people want to

And stick with delta. As that’s what makes Evil bikes awesome to ride 

Let see hopefully sooner than later 

Slavid666 wrote:
Meh, delta link is just linkage ratio manipulation through the dual link system. It created a well crafted LR and progression that was better than most...

Meh, delta link is just linkage ratio manipulation through the dual link system. It created a well crafted LR and progression that was better than most when it came out. Lots of bikes have identical or similar to LR curves now a days. Otherwise it was a single pivot, with inherent design compromises that came from the pivot location. There is a reason his newer systems use dual links, being able to tailor the AS and AR separate from the wheel path, at least IMO as an mech engineer…

FWIW: I’ve never spoken to him, it’s just my opinion based on the design progression over the years.

AS and AR can be tuned with a single pivot, either use a split pivot like Trek, or use an idler pulley and a floating brake...

AS and AR can be tuned with a single pivot, either use a split pivot like Trek, or use an idler pulley and a floating brake mount. Using those you can achieve pretty much any AR and AS levels and curves. Now this is a hot take but I feel like we are nearing the end of the low AR BS trend as people will realise that it actually doesn't do anything positive for 98% of the riders out there, while high AR make a bike calmer in sketchy situations. If/When this happen, single pivot will definitely get a second look as they allow good AR levels without resorting to crazy high AS levels (Gambler, Summum for example). 

I prefer the Crab Link. It’s the future obviously.


DW spins up designs all the time, and to me they all come across as a good marketing campaign to sell more design. Everything DW is always “better”, and DW is dogmatic that every new product is better than the Crab Link (Horst). Yawn.


I like to believe that we’ve finally hit an era in biking where a good design isn’t limited to the patent you hold or the design you licensed. Lots of smart people out there. 

23
1
Primoz
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SI
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10/15/2024 6:28am

Supposedly when it comes to designing bikes with Dave and one of his linkages it's the complete package and how the rider experiences the bike that is the main benefit, not just the marketing related to the link. Supposedly Dave has characteristics figured out to give a complete package to the brand, not just the suspension pivot points. 

5
Yoda
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IT
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10/15/2024 7:18am
Slavid666 wrote:
Meh, delta link is just linkage ratio manipulation through the dual link system. It created a well crafted LR and progression that was better than most...

Meh, delta link is just linkage ratio manipulation through the dual link system. It created a well crafted LR and progression that was better than most when it came out. Lots of bikes have identical or similar to LR curves now a days. Otherwise it was a single pivot, with inherent design compromises that came from the pivot location. There is a reason his newer systems use dual links, being able to tailor the AS and AR separate from the wheel path, at least IMO as an mech engineer…

FWIW: I’ve never spoken to him, it’s just my opinion based on the design progression over the years.

AS and AR can be tuned with a single pivot, either use a split pivot like Trek, or use an idler pulley and a floating brake...

AS and AR can be tuned with a single pivot, either use a split pivot like Trek, or use an idler pulley and a floating brake mount. Using those you can achieve pretty much any AR and AS levels and curves. Now this is a hot take but I feel like we are nearing the end of the low AR BS trend as people will realise that it actually doesn't do anything positive for 98% of the riders out there, while high AR make a bike calmer in sketchy situations. If/When this happen, single pivot will definitely get a second look as they allow good AR levels without resorting to crazy high AS levels (Gambler, Summum for example). 

MrSafeT wrote:
I prefer the Crab Link. It’s the future obviously.DW spins up designs all the time, and to me they all come across as a good marketing...

I prefer the Crab Link. It’s the future obviously.


DW spins up designs all the time, and to me they all come across as a good marketing campaign to sell more design. Everything DW is always “better”, and DW is dogmatic that every new product is better than the Crab Link (Horst). Yawn.


I like to believe that we’ve finally hit an era in biking where a good design isn’t limited to the patent you hold or the design you licensed. Lots of smart people out there. 

'Lots of smart people out there' is a great point. Bikes are generally great these days but excel in slightly different use cases, or feel slightly different but the knowledge base seems to have exploded over the past few years and engineers are making the most out of the available platforms. 

Since bikes are getting so good at what they're designed for, I think demos/testing to develop and understand your subjective preference is becoming more relevant. I've recently rented/demoed a good chunk of modern trail and enduro bikes and it was sick to see what I got along with or didn't in terms of ride feel; sizing, short/long chainstays, high/low/mid pivot, platform (Crab, VPP, DW, single, maestro, etc.)... For example I like the ride feel of Pivot's short chainstay + DW combo and my brother absolutely doesn't, but we both get along with FSR.

10
Jotegr
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10/15/2024 9:29am Edited Date/Time 10/15/2024 7:14pm
Primoz wrote:
Supposedly when it comes to designing bikes with Dave and one of his linkages it's the complete package and how the rider experiences the bike that...

Supposedly when it comes to designing bikes with Dave and one of his linkages it's the complete package and how the rider experiences the bike that is the main benefit, not just the marketing related to the link. Supposedly Dave has characteristics figured out to give a complete package to the brand, not just the suspension pivot points. 

But how do I know if the complete package from DW Link is better than the complete package from Delta Link? Or perhaps the Orion complete package? Maybe even Devinci's complete package, the split pivot?  Or whatever the complete package Pivot's downhill bike is called?

 

They obviously all work but I'm left somewhat skeptical of claims made about various suspension designs (all made by DW) when the entirety of DW's business model appears to be create a suspension design, find a buyer, and move on to the next suspension design and buyer. Is one of the above systems superior to the others in some applications? most applications? Are we sure none of them are contrived solely because the previous, superior design was licensed enough already and a new one needed to be made for sales purposes? 

 

Edit: Coming back to this, I believe I can articulate my skepticism a bit better. I'm skeptical that if Dave can get everything he wants (i.e. a complete package) out of any of the above DW-designed (not to mention DW-inspired) platforms, I'm skeptical DW can't get the complete package out of something conventional, say crab or crab adjacent, albeit with less patents and in turn, less ability to make money and less to hand over to the marketing guys. 

5
1
earleb
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North Vancouver, BC CA
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10/15/2024 9:45am

You can get really really damn close to any AS, AR*, and LR from any other platform with a linkage driven single pivot. Packaging and aesthetic would have to take a back seat but you would be surprised that all mini link/  dual link bikes can be duplicated in a linkage driven single pivot.

* low AR is the one that can't get without a floating brake. 

3
ballz
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Ouagadougou EH
10/15/2024 10:38am
Primoz wrote:
Supposedly when it comes to designing bikes with Dave and one of his linkages it's the complete package and how the rider experiences the bike that...

Supposedly when it comes to designing bikes with Dave and one of his linkages it's the complete package and how the rider experiences the bike that is the main benefit, not just the marketing related to the link. Supposedly Dave has characteristics figured out to give a complete package to the brand, not just the suspension pivot points. 

Does the complete package include shock clevis? Asking for a friend.

7
gonza.s.m.
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10/15/2024 12:20pm
mickey wrote:

If you don’t think of Evil and E.13 (named after a police precinct in Boston) as Maine-based companies, you probably aren’t in your mid 40’s, ahaha.

So Evil bikes and e13 were the same company around 2000-2003 years? just diferent name brand? I didn't know that 😀

6
Glory831Guy
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Santa Cruz, CA US
10/15/2024 12:34pm Edited Date/Time 10/15/2024 12:34pm

With suspension kinematics converging in the Crab Quadrant, I'm surprised that companies aren't touting minimum brakeaway force figures. Force to get everything moving, lateral rigidity, and overall progression would give me a better idea of how a bike really feels vs a bunch of graphs-IMO. Of course you can get more info from all those graphs, but they don't seem super useful at a glance to most people IMO.

7
boozed
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AU
10/15/2024 1:43pm
Primoz wrote:
Supposedly when it comes to designing bikes with Dave and one of his linkages it's the complete package and how the rider experiences the bike that...

Supposedly when it comes to designing bikes with Dave and one of his linkages it's the complete package and how the rider experiences the bike that is the main benefit, not just the marketing related to the link. Supposedly Dave has characteristics figured out to give a complete package to the brand, not just the suspension pivot points. 

That has come up before, I think in an interview with Atherton?  He looks at additional proprietary measure(s) that he developed and not just AS/AR/LR when he designs the system.  But the brands won't say what they are.

My immediate thought was that if there's this extra property that you think is beneficial to the owner, but you're not allowed to tell the owner what it is beyond some extremely vague implications about its existence, why should the prospective owner be remotely interested?

 

9
noodlenosteeze
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10/15/2024 1:49pm
With suspension kinematics converging in the Crab Quadrant, I'm surprised that companies aren't touting minimum brakeaway force figures. Force to get everything moving, lateral rigidity, and...

With suspension kinematics converging in the Crab Quadrant, I'm surprised that companies aren't touting minimum brakeaway force figures. Force to get everything moving, lateral rigidity, and overall progression would give me a better idea of how a bike really feels vs a bunch of graphs-IMO. Of course you can get more info from all those graphs, but they don't seem super useful at a glance to most people IMO.

You mean you can't just have your marketing dept say it's "plush when you need it to" but "stiff for the roughest lines" ?

4
kperras
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10/15/2024 1:53pm
With suspension kinematics converging in the Crab Quadrant, I'm surprised that companies aren't touting minimum brakeaway force figures. Force to get everything moving, lateral rigidity, and...

With suspension kinematics converging in the Crab Quadrant, I'm surprised that companies aren't touting minimum brakeaway force figures. Force to get everything moving, lateral rigidity, and overall progression would give me a better idea of how a bike really feels vs a bunch of graphs-IMO. Of course you can get more info from all those graphs, but they don't seem super useful at a glance to most people IMO.

You can get that info from rate curve graphs. It shows the starting rate. The smaller the number, in terms of rate so say .333, the less force required to activate the suspension. If you're reading a ratio graph, then it's the larger the number, like 3 which is the inverse of the above. That only tells part of the story though because force at rear wheel graphs are a more complete picture for suspension activation because that includes the shock's spring rate. This still excludes the behavior exhibited by the shock tune. Overall progression percentage can be calculated by dividing the end value by the start value, subtract 1. 

Then we get to the part that there is no right answer, but rather a (large) window of acceptable operation and everyone will have a subjective opinion about what is best. 

6
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jonkranked
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10/15/2024 1:54pm
mickey wrote:

If you don’t think of Evil and E.13 (named after a police precinct in Boston) as Maine-based companies, you probably aren’t in your mid 40’s, ahaha.

gonza.s.m. wrote:

So Evil bikes and e13 were the same company around 2000-2003 years? just diferent name brand? I didn't know that 😀

i still have an evil branded bashguard from their first chainguide somewhere. 

7
Rick26
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., QC CA
10/15/2024 1:56pm
TannerVal wrote:
IMG 3179.png?VersionId=9PO.ECs2rZ33bxGwReGo1rU

UDH Enduro is up on their website since this morning and I'm surprised that Specialized packed a very good value in the two builds & S-Works frameset.

Even the entry level Comp build is solid, just need to slap a Charger 3.1 damper in the ZEB Select and you're all set.

 

7
Jotegr
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10/15/2024 2:12pm Edited Date/Time 10/15/2024 2:15pm

They'd better be able to pack good value into the builds, they paid for 4/5ths of the tooling and all the R&D years ago. This bike has been available since Fall 2019, yes, it remains excellent, no, consumers should not be paying a premium for it. 

 

Edit: the fact that the value of the Comp is actually pretty good is indeed surprising. 

11
Glory831Guy
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Santa Cruz, CA US
10/15/2024 3:34pm
With suspension kinematics converging in the Crab Quadrant, I'm surprised that companies aren't touting minimum brakeaway force figures. Force to get everything moving, lateral rigidity, and...

With suspension kinematics converging in the Crab Quadrant, I'm surprised that companies aren't touting minimum brakeaway force figures. Force to get everything moving, lateral rigidity, and overall progression would give me a better idea of how a bike really feels vs a bunch of graphs-IMO. Of course you can get more info from all those graphs, but they don't seem super useful at a glance to most people IMO.

kperras wrote:
You can get that info from rate curve graphs. It shows the starting rate. The smaller the number, in terms of rate so say .333, the...

You can get that info from rate curve graphs. It shows the starting rate. The smaller the number, in terms of rate so say .333, the less force required to activate the suspension. If you're reading a ratio graph, then it's the larger the number, like 3 which is the inverse of the above. That only tells part of the story though because force at rear wheel graphs are a more complete picture for suspension activation because that includes the shock's spring rate. This still excludes the behavior exhibited by the shock tune. Overall progression percentage can be calculated by dividing the end value by the start value, subtract 1. 

Then we get to the part that there is no right answer, but rather a (large) window of acceptable operation and everyone will have a subjective opinion about what is best. 

Yeah, I didn't really understand any of those graphs prior to buying a Cascade link. I didn't commit to buying it before I understood the changes it would be making, based on their comparison graphs. They aren't too hard to wrap your head around, but I feel like they aren't super intuitive either, especially when peoples' graphs have different scales ect. 

I couldn't go back to the stock linkage at this point. I think that's down to the increased wheelbase more than the leverage rate though tbh. As you say, there is a wide window of acceptable operation.

 

1
Nico_Hrndz
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FR
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10/16/2024 1:13am Edited Date/Time 10/16/2024 5:11am

Vojo magazine posted a few new things here and there, regarding last Roc d'Azur:

Including a few Polygon """protos""" :

Roc-dAzur-salon-Vojo-A.Protano-1-45-2048x1280.jpg?VersionId=8WGtYLzEADJDGqZtRoc-dAzur-salon-Vojo-A.Protano-1-44-2048x1280 0.jpg?VersionId=WMZOiX8YRoc-dAzur-salon-Vojo-A.Protano-1-43-2048x1280 0.jpg?VersionId=TepyLHPyrC4JgLOhjE9tAt

 

And more interesting, the Beringer ebike (we already knew about their mtb brakes, wasn't aware of the frame development) which is made from cast aluminium. As an absolutely-not-engineer guy I like seeing these kind of attempts on frame material, but some may have another perspective I guess... (regardless of kinematics / geo)

roc-azur-salon-nouveautes-salon-vojo-paul-humbert-13.jpg?VersionId=ucUUrxwTWsQ9phK3roc-azur-salon-nouveautes-salon-vojo-paul-humbert-15roc-azur-salon-nouveautes-salon-vojo-paul-humbert-17.jpg?VersionId=W

 

17
gibbon
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10/16/2024 4:31am
jonkranked wrote:

i still have an evil branded bashguard from their first chainguide somewhere. 

My dude.....we old (I turned 51 last week).

9
Rick26
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., QC CA
10/16/2024 5:57am

That would be the 2025 Instinct SL according to another forum, is someone able to confirm if that's really the case ?

Looks like it's just a smaller battery & retuned motor in the existing full power Instinct frame, nothing too exciting.

 

Screenshot-20241014-212847
6
jsray
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10/16/2024 6:02am
Rick26 wrote:
That would be the 2025 Instinct SL according to another forum, is someone able to confirm if that's really the case ?Looks like it's just a...

That would be the 2025 Instinct SL according to another forum, is someone able to confirm if that's really the case ?

Looks like it's just a smaller battery & retuned motor in the existing full power Instinct frame, nothing too exciting.

 

Screenshot-20241014-212847

could be the picture but the angle of the shock looks different. Definitely a different brake mount going on there. And the motor does look smaller. Also, the little knock block under the head tube isn’t there. 

4
HexonJuan
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WI US
10/16/2024 6:41am
jonkranked wrote:

i still have an evil branded bashguard from their first chainguide somewhere. 

gibbon wrote:

My dude.....we old (I turned 51 last week).

Ditto to all the above here too!

3
HexonJuan
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10/16/2024 6:46am
iceman2058 wrote:
BOS is apparently poised to make a major push back into the MTB market, they have refreshed their entire range of products - it all drops...

BOS is apparently poised to make a major push back into the MTB market, they have refreshed their entire range of products - it all drops on November 11 but here's the info already: https://www.vitalmtb.com/news/press-release/bos-suspension-launches-bos….

HexonJuan wrote:

Will they still have the terrible customer service and poor parts availability that we grew to love back in their first foray? Time will tell!

jonkranked wrote:

and their second foray 

Almost forgot about that one. Complete example of flash in the pan. 

1
metadave
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10/16/2024 7:38am
Rick26 wrote:
That would be the 2025 Instinct SL according to another forum, is someone able to confirm if that's really the case ?Looks like it's just a...

That would be the 2025 Instinct SL according to another forum, is someone able to confirm if that's really the case ?

Looks like it's just a smaller battery & retuned motor in the existing full power Instinct frame, nothing too exciting.

 

Screenshot-20241014-212847

It's different. 

2
noodlenosteeze
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10/16/2024 9:32am
Nico_Hrndz wrote:
Vojo magazine posted a few new things here and there, regarding last Roc d'Azur:Including a few Polygon """protos""" : And more interesting, the Beringer ebike (we...

Vojo magazine posted a few new things here and there, regarding last Roc d'Azur:

Including a few Polygon """protos""" :

Roc-dAzur-salon-Vojo-A.Protano-1-45-2048x1280.jpg?VersionId=8WGtYLzEADJDGqZtRoc-dAzur-salon-Vojo-A.Protano-1-44-2048x1280 0.jpg?VersionId=WMZOiX8YRoc-dAzur-salon-Vojo-A.Protano-1-43-2048x1280 0.jpg?VersionId=TepyLHPyrC4JgLOhjE9tAt

 

And more interesting, the Beringer ebike (we already knew about their mtb brakes, wasn't aware of the frame development) which is made from cast aluminium. As an absolutely-not-engineer guy I like seeing these kind of attempts on frame material, but some may have another perspective I guess... (regardless of kinematics / geo)

roc-azur-salon-nouveautes-salon-vojo-paul-humbert-13.jpg?VersionId=ucUUrxwTWsQ9phK3roc-azur-salon-nouveautes-salon-vojo-paul-humbert-15roc-azur-salon-nouveautes-salon-vojo-paul-humbert-17.jpg?VersionId=W

 

Nice KHS!

4
Eae903
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Laramie, WY US
10/16/2024 11:24am
With suspension kinematics converging in the Crab Quadrant, I'm surprised that companies aren't touting minimum brakeaway force figures. Force to get everything moving, lateral rigidity, and...

With suspension kinematics converging in the Crab Quadrant, I'm surprised that companies aren't touting minimum brakeaway force figures. Force to get everything moving, lateral rigidity, and overall progression would give me a better idea of how a bike really feels vs a bunch of graphs-IMO. Of course you can get more info from all those graphs, but they don't seem super useful at a glance to most people IMO.

kperras wrote:
You can get that info from rate curve graphs. It shows the starting rate. The smaller the number, in terms of rate so say .333, the...

You can get that info from rate curve graphs. It shows the starting rate. The smaller the number, in terms of rate so say .333, the less force required to activate the suspension. If you're reading a ratio graph, then it's the larger the number, like 3 which is the inverse of the above. That only tells part of the story though because force at rear wheel graphs are a more complete picture for suspension activation because that includes the shock's spring rate. This still excludes the behavior exhibited by the shock tune. Overall progression percentage can be calculated by dividing the end value by the start value, subtract 1. 

Then we get to the part that there is no right answer, but rather a (large) window of acceptable operation and everyone will have a subjective opinion about what is best. 

There is room for all kinds of crabs. No one objectively better solution, all out crab performance doesn't have to be the goal. 

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Eae903
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10/16/2024 11:30am
iceman2058 wrote:
BOS is apparently poised to make a major push back into the MTB market, they have refreshed their entire range of products - it all drops...

BOS is apparently poised to make a major push back into the MTB market, they have refreshed their entire range of products - it all drops on November 11 but here's the info already: https://www.vitalmtb.com/news/press-release/bos-suspension-launches-bos….

Cedric Gracia has been riding them for a while. I like the idea of their Idyll 39 SC Fork, reminds me of the RS totem air, but I'm not a huge fan that they're only available with a 20x110 boost axle. A larger diamater stiffer axle isn't a bad idea, but wheel availability isn't going the be good if you need to get a new one in a pinch.

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