Unicorn Bike: Write your frame spec that doesn't exist (yet)

Related:
jeff.brines
Posts
898
Joined
8/29/2010
Location
Grand Junction, CO US
A few years ago I was fairly convinced we'd hit the upper end of what was possible with bike design. I still (sort of) feel that way as the changes really are more incremental. Especially if you are 5'10" and ride a medium/large bike. I can explain why rider size plays into this if someone wants, but will leave that out as its not really the point here..

That said, I started adding up a few things I'd really like to see on my personal bike, and then I realized the bike I really want doesn't actually exist. (unless I go custom)

For the hell of it, I thought it'd be fun to write down a few things I'd like to see, and thought others might want to do this as well...

Here is the Jeff Brines Super Mega No Excuses Bike

• 29" wheels
• 160mm rear travel. Something that mirrors the leverage ratio curve/shock stroke of the Nomad with a moderatly high pivot point (new GT DH bike) and an idler pully. Not asking for a crazy high pivot, just slightly higher than chainring (maybe 1"). Antisquat over 100% in the pedal zone. Air/coil compatible. Utilizes very little compression damping to achieve control through the shock's stroke (relies more on leverage ratio curve) EDIT: I could be talked out of the higher pivot point btw)
• 500mm reach
• 450mm chainstays (adjustable from 445-460mm)
• 340mm bb w/2.5" rubber
• 63.5 deg headtube angle
• fork offset 37mm or less
• 50mm stem
• 76 deg seat tube angle
• 180mm fork
• clearance for up to 2.6" rubber
• triple clamp compatible
• Uber short head tube (i mean we don't have to go nuts, but not a big headtube)
• No gimmicks (no knockblock, no proprietary parts)
• SUPER short seat tube (170mm dropper no problem)
• Aluminum (yup)
• Under 9 pounds with shock
• Optional bar mounted lockout
• Water bottle mount inside the frame
• Low COG
• Lowish standover
• Clearance for a 36 tooth chainring
• Stout feeling (I don't want a flexy frame)

The goal here is to have reach that feels good under my 6'2" frame (long legs/arms) without placing me too far back on the bike (which continues to be a problem). Longer stays, reduced offset both go to combat this. With the direction of enduro I want this bike to be as poised and comfortable in ragged terrain as possible. Yes, I know, it'll be a handful in tighter terrain, but a well balanced bike is going to handle better than a short skittish bike where i'm trying like hell to keep weight on the front tire.

These numbers likely wouldn't work if you start to reduce the reach. I also don't think they'd be super fast if you are lighter. Bigger guys can use more travel without it being as big of a hindrance IMO.

One day we'll have real time Danny Hart level telemetry to see how a bike is really performing under you, the rider. This will dictate fit, sizing, etc. That'll be a real game changer to getting a bike to work perfectly under the rider, but we're a decade off of this...







2
|
Masjo
Posts
208
Joined
11/25/2014
Location
Ancaster CA
8/28/2018 7:52am
I would like to propose an addition to the title of this thread: If you know of a bike that is similar, let us know!

Living in the northeast, I've always been excited for a true 'east coast mountain' bike. Since we don't have actual mountains (more like rolling hills), that would be something like:

Wheel size: take your pick
120-140mm frame
120-150mm fork with reduced offset
65 or similar reasonably slack head angle
77 degree seat tube angle
Adequate reach, 470-490 for a ~6' individual like myself
350mm bb height (depending on travel, something that won't smack all of our rocks with 170mm cranks!)
440mm chainstays or so, not too short since we have a lot of 'punchy' climbs

Basically, something similar to one of the new 'long-low-slack enduro' bikes but paired with lower travel. I don't need 160-180mm of travel for my day-to-day (or even bike park) riding out here, but I wouldn't mind my bike still handling well on our tech descents! There's too many steep downs and ups full of rocks to comfortably ride a true XC bike the way I want to. I think we are getting close with some more aggressive XC/marathon bikes like the SB100/Blur, but I wouldn't mind something with a bit more travel and a bit slacker angles to be able to handle a park day at our local 'mountain'
jeff.brines
Posts
898
Joined
8/29/2010
Location
Grand Junction, CO US
8/28/2018 7:58am
Masjo wrote:
I would like to propose an addition to the title of this thread: If you know of a bike that is similar, let us know! Living...
I would like to propose an addition to the title of this thread: If you know of a bike that is similar, let us know!

Living in the northeast, I've always been excited for a true 'east coast mountain' bike. Since we don't have actual mountains (more like rolling hills), that would be something like:

Wheel size: take your pick
120-140mm frame
120-150mm fork with reduced offset
65 or similar reasonably slack head angle
77 degree seat tube angle
Adequate reach, 470-490 for a ~6' individual like myself
350mm bb height (depending on travel, something that won't smack all of our rocks with 170mm cranks!)
440mm chainstays or so, not too short since we have a lot of 'punchy' climbs

Basically, something similar to one of the new 'long-low-slack enduro' bikes but paired with lower travel. I don't need 160-180mm of travel for my day-to-day (or even bike park) riding out here, but I wouldn't mind my bike still handling well on our tech descents! There's too many steep downs and ups full of rocks to comfortably ride a true XC bike the way I want to. I think we are getting close with some more aggressive XC/marathon bikes like the SB100/Blur, but I wouldn't mind something with a bit more travel and a bit slacker angles to be able to handle a park day at our local 'mountain'
https://www.transitionbikes.com/Bikes_2019_SmugglerCarbonXO1.cfm Smuggler isn't far off. Angleset it down to 65 degs and deal with the slightly shorter chainstays than you want, slam the seat as far forward on the rails as it'll go and boom. You basically have it.
8/28/2018 1:23pm
I would love a do it all, all mountain bike with a rear travel adjust from 135-145. 150 fork with a head tube angle of around 66 degrees in the 135 and a 65 in the 145. Just slack enough for the local bike parks but snappy enough for every day riding (Shorter offset). Big wheels for obvious reasons but the clearance for 29x2.6 tires. A Suspension design similar to VPP or Switch infinity would be great to deal with the rocks of the East coast. Frame storage features would be great so you could store spares without the need of a backpack.
whitesq
Posts
43
Joined
8/1/2014
Location
FC, CO US
8/29/2018 9:09am
A few years ago I was fairly convinced we'd hit the upper end of what was possible with bike design. I still (sort of) feel that...
A few years ago I was fairly convinced we'd hit the upper end of what was possible with bike design. I still (sort of) feel that way as the changes really are more incremental. Especially if you are 5'10" and ride a medium/large bike. I can explain why rider size plays into this if someone wants, but will leave that out as its not really the point here..

That said, I started adding up a few things I'd really like to see on my personal bike, and then I realized the bike I really want doesn't actually exist. (unless I go custom)

For the hell of it, I thought it'd be fun to write down a few things I'd like to see, and thought others might want to do this as well...

Here is the Jeff Brines Super Mega No Excuses Bike

• 29" wheels
• 160mm rear travel. Something that mirrors the leverage ratio curve/shock stroke of the Nomad with a moderatly high pivot point (new GT DH bike) and an idler pully. Not asking for a crazy high pivot, just slightly higher than chainring (maybe 1"). Antisquat over 100% in the pedal zone. Air/coil compatible. Utilizes very little compression damping to achieve control through the shock's stroke (relies more on leverage ratio curve) EDIT: I could be talked out of the higher pivot point btw)
• 500mm reach
• 450mm chainstays (adjustable from 445-460mm)
• 340mm bb w/2.5" rubber
• 63.5 deg headtube angle
• fork offset 37mm or less
• 50mm stem
• 76 deg seat tube angle
• 180mm fork
• clearance for up to 2.6" rubber
• triple clamp compatible
• Uber short head tube (i mean we don't have to go nuts, but not a big headtube)
• No gimmicks (no knockblock, no proprietary parts)
• SUPER short seat tube (170mm dropper no problem)
• Aluminum (yup)
• Under 9 pounds with shock
• Optional bar mounted lockout
• Water bottle mount inside the frame
• Low COG
• Lowish standover
• Clearance for a 36 tooth chainring
• Stout feeling (I don't want a flexy frame)

The goal here is to have reach that feels good under my 6'2" frame (long legs/arms) without placing me too far back on the bike (which continues to be a problem). Longer stays, reduced offset both go to combat this. With the direction of enduro I want this bike to be as poised and comfortable in ragged terrain as possible. Yes, I know, it'll be a handful in tighter terrain, but a well balanced bike is going to handle better than a short skittish bike where i'm trying like hell to keep weight on the front tire.

These numbers likely wouldn't work if you start to reduce the reach. I also don't think they'd be super fast if you are lighter. Bigger guys can use more travel without it being as big of a hindrance IMO.

One day we'll have real time Danny Hart level telemetry to see how a bike is really performing under you, the rider. This will dictate fit, sizing, etc. That'll be a real game changer to getting a bike to work perfectly under the rider, but we're a decade off of this...







I would like to buy this bike... cash in hand!

For reference I'm 6'2" and on a large 29er geometron. I love the 62 deg HA, but the reach/WB is just a bit too long. I thought about going down to a medium but I really want that Nomad/Wreckoning leverage too. SC needs to hurry up and drop the 29er nomad!
Falcon
Posts
368
Joined
9/6/2015
Location
Menifee, CA US
8/29/2018 5:31pm
To be fair, the modern enduro/trail bike is way closer than MTBs were ten years ago, but I'd still like a bicycle that more closely mimics the seat/handlebar relationship of a motocross motorcycle. Sure, it might not work as well, but it would be a lot more comfortable for me in most conditions. I need my bars to go up about 6". No amount of stack height adjustment is going to give me that.
I find it really strains my neck after an hour or so in the saddle if I have to bend my head upward to see where I'm going.

Post a reply to: Unicorn Bike: Write your frame spec that doesn't exist (yet)

The Latest