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16
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4/3/2022
Location
Golden, CO
US
So we’ve all seen the hype behind the Mavens, I’m sure most of us read the press release and watched the initial reviews from mtb media. Since the release though, I can’t find many opinions/reviews from consumers. There’s a bit on the mtbr forums, but I found most responses to be of little use. There was some interesting discussion about these brakes having a wandering bite point though. My question is, does anyone here have on-trail experience with these brakes, or any insight regarding serviceability/durability?
bike park season starts in about a month here for me. need to get them mounted up on ye olde dh rig before then. and new tires too.
I've got a couple rides in on Mavens mounted on my trail bike. Quite honestly, I'm blown away at the power. I am 215# and have always had gripes with every brake I've used. I followed SRAM online vids for install and piston massage and have had no issues. Again, I'm only two rides in. Sorry I don't have info on durability.
been riding mine for 4 weeks and loving them. coming from code RCSs and beeing on the lighter side with around 74 kg, i was pretty happy with them for the most time.
lots of power but with great modulation and similar feeling to codes.
bite point sometimes has a little bit of wandering away from the bars, but nothing annoying IMO. mavens were installed by my local BS because there was some bigger servicing (suspension) to do anyway, so i can‘t say anything on the topic of installation or maintenance.
edit: i'm using 200 front/rear with organic pads, tried sintered first in the rear (same as with codes) but the wheel locked up way too easily.
I've got about 25 hours on them. Have been amazing so far. 66kg/~146lbs. 180mm rotors w/organic pads. All the power and modulation is great (have ridden steep muddy/wet trails and able to modulate to avoid lockup). I will say, you must do the full piston massage protocol, during setup, that is not well documented in SRAM info (at least when I installed). Gets the lever feeling just like a Code and minimizes the slight wandering bike point that seems to be a trait of mineral fluid brakes.
Enduro mtb mag recently updated their brake test - dynoing and testing a decent range of different brakes, including the Mavens. Seems like their actual performance might not match SRAM's marketing hype though - the most powerful brakes were the Hope V4 with Trickstuff 2nd and the Hayes Dominion won the test overall... Unfortunately I can't see that they've published the dyno numbers yet
got a link?
I wonder if you can now run SRAM levers in place of shimano when running Shigura setup..? A guy on MTBR says he’s running Maven calipers with Shimano levers. I’d run SRAM levers for contact adjust as well as the better matchmaker setup. I’ve gone thru 3 or 4 ProblemSolver and wolftooths I-spec mounts.
I ran these before moving to Intends. I've also tried a bunch of other brakes. Most of the mtbr discussion is people dogpiling SRAM due to that youtube review by Dale Stone. I tried to offer some useful commentary there but eventually got tired of arguing with people who would never try them and just wanted to shit on SRAM (which I can relate to given my CS experiences with them).
I'm not really sure where Enduro MTB got the power numbers from, I can say in terms of feel at least, the Mavens seem to have more power earlier in the lever throw than the Maximas did. It was a bit disorienting until I got adjusted to them. There may be less total power available, but in terms of ride feel, they bite a lot harder a lot faster IMO. Same for the Intends. The Maximas produce great power, but I found it comes on much later in the lever throw than the Mavens or Intends.
Setup was easy, except for two factors. First, the lever reservoir sits super close to the bars, which is annoying when trying to place other levers. If you use Matchmaker, it's a non issue, but most lever clamps are too thick to sit between the reservoir and the bar, so you end up having to adjust your cockpit around them and this may put your shifter/dropper lever too close. Second is the bite point, SRAM suggests a piston massage procedure, but I did that probably a half dozen times or more and the rear wandered badly. It wasn't until I was told to put two rotors together, slot them into the caliper, and pull the lever really hard to the bar that the problem went away. Some reported this doesn't fix it for them, so YMMV, but pulling it hard to the bar is key. I tried without doing that and it didn't do anything. There is a minimal amount of lever flex, I feel like a brake like this should've had a brace like Intend, Trickstuff, Radic, etc do, but it's barely noticed when riding.
Bleed is easy. Everything else in terms of setup was simple.
The power is really good, it will take some adjustment, because it ramps up really quickly and they bite really hard and fast. I didn't try metallic pads, just organic with 200/200 rotors. I've used most brakes on the market and these seem to bite harder, sooner than anything else I've tried. It's not difficult to modulate them, but other users I've spoke with said they used the contact point adjuster more than they did with other SRAM brakes. I like that quick bite, so I didn't, but you may need to depending on weight and preference. I had no issues with fade but I didn't ride any trails I would've anticipated fade on. I did try and I got them pretty warm, but nothing changed.
The lever feel is firmer than many others, but once the pads engage, the amount of power you get for the lever force you put down is really good. Getting through the deadstroke requires more force than other brakes I've used, but once the bite point engages, you get a lot of power for a lighter pull than other options IMO. The only exception to that may be the Hope T4 V4 and Maximas, both of which have a lighter pull when the pads engage. I know there's been a lot of discussion around this, but as someone with chronic, severe hand problems, I had 0 issues with the Mavens and they actually reduced my issues due to the way I could feather the bite point to get great power. Point being, yes it's a firmer pull, but the overall power delivery for the force you put in is better than others I've tried. IMO the force required to pull through the deadstroke is largely a meaningless measurement unless correlated with how much force is required to pull through the lever stroke at the bite point and the amount of power you get, but some don't agree.
They are heavy and ugly. The black/silver ones look more subtle and better, the red ones I got stand out like a sore thumb.
I still generally recommend Dominons to 99% of riders. I would only suggest these to riders over 200lbs riding heavy 29ers and doing a lot of aggressive downhill riding. IMO lighter riders will have more problems especially if they don't dial things in with rotor size, pad compound, and bite point, but my 220lb lard ass had no issues. They are some of the better brakes I've tried, I just can't get over the form factor, it's awful.
Overall, I'd put them above the MT7, XTs, Code, and Saints, on par with Dominions, Radic, Hope T4 V4, and Maximas, but inferior to the Intends. In power progression/delivery, better than MT7, XT, Code, Saint, Dominions, and Maximas, on par with Radic and Intend. In lever feel/lightness overall, Hope T4 V4, Maximas, and Intend are both substantially better, Dominions are lighter in the deadstroke but about on par once they engage, Radic is a bit lighter but requires a firmer touch when they engage, MT7s are more consistent but require a longer throw. If you like a super light lever throughout pad engagement, the Hopes and Maximas will be better, if you want faster power delivery, Maven or Intends will require more force to pull but will ramp up power faster.
Before you ask, I've tried all of these because my hand/arm problems may force me to quit riding bikes this summer if they don't improve, so I've been scrambling to try different things to see what helps and brakes are a big part of that. It's also cheaper than having surgery (again)
Running Intends too, love them so much that I have them on both bikes now. Ran Hayes before the Intends, never had any issues with those either, until my wife demanded I hand over mine so she doesn't need to run the Codes anymore. Would like to add if something is easier to do, then it's probably also easier to do right - in this case bleeding the Intends was probably the easiest bleed I have EVER done. No massaging, no nonsense, just push the damn fluid in through the calipers and that's it. Hayes are pretty good in that regard too, the bleed is pretty easy to get right. Now the Maximas and the Mavens..not so much. The Mavens have their massage procedure, while the Maximas have a couple steps to advance pistons and placing the master cylinder in different positions. Would they matter to the seasoned bike mechanic? Probably not. But for the garage DIY guys such as myself, I just find this little bit of friction being a pain point.
I'm not really sure what SRAM is going to do about the massage situation with the Mavens. They are eventually going to start trickling down into OEM builds and assemblers aren't going to do that procedure, it's something that should've been done at the factory, but my concern is that whatever it is doing needs to be done when the brakes sit idle for a while. Time will tell.
I had no issues bleeding the Maximas. I know a lot of people reported problems, but they were fine the first time through for me. I usually double check the bleed after a few rides and nothing came out, maybe I just got lucky.
I did have one issue setting up the Intends. The pads would drag ever so slightly, enough to squeal, and I noticed one of the pistons was kindof sticking a little bit. I "massaged" them and did a ride where they got some pretty good heat going, then the problem stopped. Another user reported the same thing until he had gotten them on the hotter side, then it went away. It's a minor thing and they've been great otherwise, but it was irritating until it went away. I think their biggest flaw is the size of the lever combined with the reservoir shape, if you use really large grips (think Meaty Paws), then the lever blade won't reach far enough outward for you to use it. They are nearly slammed on my normal size grips and just barely have enough lever length for me, this is something I think some people will have issues with but not others.
You really can't go wrong with any of these, they are all great, some just have different drawbacks than others.
No link yet - hopefully they'll post the article along with the dyno stats soon. To view it you have to download the app and then the most recent edition to view the test
I have been running the Mavens for over a month now. It took me a few rides to get used to the power delivery and progressive nature of it through the stroke. Coming from 7 years of riding and preferring the feel of the Code RSC, I find the ergonomics familiar and that's good because I really like the feel of Code RSCs.
Overall, I'm very impressed. The amount of power is ridiculous.
Let's start with installation. Following the SRAM's bleeding procedures, the brakes, especially the rear, had this dead stroke characteristic when engage more predominantly when I repeatedly pump the levers on the descents. I found this discouraging as it sort of made me adjust my usual braking points on familiar DH trails. The best I could describe it was that the brakes felt like it had a bit of air in the system. So I rebled a few times including the piston massage step but still yielded the same feel.
Being very familiar with the current crop of SRAM brakes bleed procedure, I can't help but notice that in the Maven bleed video, to me, it appears that it skipped what I think is a crucial step which was a standard on all Code brakes bleed. The isolated bleeding of the caliper. So when I performed my usual Code bleed on my next (and 4th time) Maven re-bleed which required the master cylinder closed (pulled lever), I drew quite a bit of air bubbles from the Maven calipers. I pressurized and vacuumed the calipers several times until very tiny to no air were drawn. This seem to have solved my wandering bite point just like that. The only thing I notice now is the incidental "pump out" but this is ever-present on all brake system. It's just a hydraulic certainty but seems a bit more noticeable on the Maven (maybe due to increased oil volume??).
Nonetheless, I'm sold. It's been such a pleasure to come in hotter on sections now knowing that I have much deeper or later braking points. Plus, I look forward to lower maintenance. A fact that I had to live with my Codes. To keep the Codes working precisely as I want to, I had to give it a fresh bleed just about every 2-3 months.
Pretty stoked!
The manual also stated that you could perform the "massaging" on the trail by pulling the lever fully and firmly 5 or so times to set the pistons.
What I also found helpful, as with the previous Codes, it helps to pressurize the system from the bleeding edge end after you had removed the syringe from the master cylinder and closed the port to compensate for the slight pressure and fluid loss from that step. Just make sure the pistons are pushed back in when pressurizing or you take up room for fluid expansion.
World Cup mechanics are magicians. :D
so you have zero experience with mavens, got it
as shinook said there can also be (minor) problems with very expensive boutique brakes alla intend.
since i‘ve real world experience with mavens i can report zero real issues with them.
cool, thanks for the info. would like to review their testing methodologies and results. i'm currently on dominions and picked up a set of mavens to try out.
I'm interested to see how the Mavens compare to the Dominions, as I ran the latter for two years. General consensus seems like the Mavens have a stiffer dead-stroke pull but that they have more power than the Dominions, which (at least for heavier/more aggressive riders) makes up for the stiffer initial pull.
I was very strongly considering the Mavens for my new build, however the general woes of wandering bite point plus a finicky setup swayed me away from them. Thanks to advice from @Shinook and @ozzer though, it looks like there are consistent methods to solve (or at least help with) those problems. I ended up going with Formula Cura 4s based on a quite low price and very very good reviews, but now I might be slightly regretting my decision...
I ran the Dominions for a long time, they are great brakes and the pull through the deadstroke is really light, but once the pads engage I don't think there is a huge difference in hand force required to put power down on either. If anything, the Mavens have a stronger, faster, and more progressive bite than the Dominions do.
I could also fade Dominions on some trails, although it's really noticeable for me because I prefer to run levers as close to the bar as possible. The Dominions also have a longer deadstroke.
OMG, don't get me started with the Cura though, I'm hopeful, the new iteration is leaps and bounds better than what we rode when we picked Formula up as our brake supplier. Jesus! Talk about inconsistent bleed outcome no matter what we did. Then the constant pumping we experience under sustained braking on sustained steep grades. I don't think Cura's oil volume managed heat as well.
I like the Dominion I tried but the Mavens feel just a bit more refined, robust and the progressive power delivery is just better. I really liked the caliper bolt set screws on the Hayes. I'm sure those reduce the caliper realignment over its use.
In fairness to the Formula Cura, it worked better than the other Formula I had. The other much worst product I had to run was another Formula brake set, I believe it's called "The One." We had to run it because our partner, E13, at the time was also the Formula NA distributor. Lucky us. Those brakes pumped up just standing still. I snuck Shimano Saints mid-season and no one cared. LOL.
OMG, those first generation Zokie 888- undisputed top-out king of a klunker... that was replaced with a Boxxer WC too. Riders are sooooo lucky these days. Shit work just as good as others, stock, out of the box.
That's an awesome photo, wish I had a garage floor like that near me to replicate it with my new build haha. I have high hopes for the Formulas, I made another thread about them and I got a ton of very positive responses about them. I do think they've changed a fair bit since you were riding them. Anyway, back on topic...
No mention of Hutchison tires? I'm assuming those went directly onto craigslist and got replaced with sharpied Maxxis or Schwalbe.
Yo yo yo.. one product at a time.. lol
Believe it or not, we survived on them Hutchie tires. The saving grace was that they had decent sidewall protection and we could run them tubeless which was still a novelty practice in the early 2010s. Thank god for the legendary old Mavic rims too. They're like the DT Swiss rims at that time.
Factoid: Super Grom Bruni and Loris ran Hutchies early in their grom days with Lapiere and they used black shoe polish rather than sharpie as needed. :D
Now back to the revered champagne Hayes Mag topic
When you say mavens have more progressive bite, does that mean you can squeeze harder to get more power? While dominions get more of their total power at the bite point and squeezing harder doesn’t add get that much more braking power?
Have you tried TRPs? How do they stack up against mavens and others?
Sorry to hear about your grip fading; I have had good luck with exercises and trigger point massage from physical therapist that is also a certified manual therapist.
Thanks and good luck
Maybe I used incorrect terminology, but what I mean by "progressive" is that the power the brakes put out comes sooner in the lever stroke than a more linear brake. In other words, pulling the lever a shorter distance yields more power for the distance and effort.
If you compare them to the Maximas or Dominions, for instance, the amount of power you get for say 1cm of lever pull is greater (or felt that way to me anyway). It means that you can get more power for a shorter amount of lever pull. This isn't accounting for deadstroke, just once the pads engage. I can't measure this objectively, so it's just an opinion. Honestly it's kindof nitpicking on all of those, they are all so close it's hard to be 100% certain, so I'm just basing it on ride feel. They are all really good.
Thanks. I hope I can get my stuff dealt with too. My issues stem from a compressed nerve in my arm, it's been surgically dealt with but the nerve isn't healing completely or I still have compression somewhere :/
they will publish those once on the website, that's what they told me, cannot wait
enduro-mtb has their brake shootout online:
https://enduro-mtb.com/en/best-mtb-disc-brake-can-buy/
maven
https://enduro-mtb.com/en/sram-maven-ultimate-mtb-brakes-comparison-202…
Beat me to it...
So in terms of actual figures, the Maven is in the same sorta ballpark as Shimano XTR and Hayes Dominion in terms of power (with stock pads) and the Hope V4 and Trickstuff Maxima are in another league.
But then the Maven weighs a tonne and costs more than every other brake (except the Maxima and joint w/ Dominion) in euros at least.
Hmmmm....
The test results are a bit strange to me.
I rode Maximas and Dominion's.Maxima's power is similar but it's not a consistent brake at all (which the Maven's so far are).
The Hayes power was not in a same league at all (again,my feeling only).
I mentioned it on the Tech thread, but they only did one test of the Mavens on organic pads. Not saying the test is wrong, just felt like that should be mentioned.
When I tried some Mavens on a Sram rep's bike I gave a small pull and ended up almost over the bars (and I'm 200 lbs), which is a sensation I've never gotten from any of the brakes I've tried. So I'd say my own testing might disagree with these results.
sintered are another level with mavens, wheels lock up too quick for me, i can speak from experience... too much for me, but with organic pads they are perfect.
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