A Year Later, Is World Cup Downhill Racing Better? 26

Jack Rice goes to the riders, mechanics and managers to get their opinions for The Inside Line.

sspomer
10/9/2023 10:44am
MSAyoutube

We have another great Inside Line with passionate interviews from the ground at the last World Cup Mountain Bike Downhill of 2023 in Mont-Sainte-Anne. Jack Rice talks to Elite riders, mechanics and team managers and asks if they think downhill is in a better place now than it was a year ago after the change from Red Bull's involvement to Warner Bros/Discovery. Bernard Kerr, Loic Bruni, Abigail Hogie has a lot of insight, Jordi from FOX and more. There are timestamps of the individual interviews in the description below.

Everyone here at Vital would like to thank Jack, John Lawlor and Rick Schubert for their hard work during this World Cup season. Enjoy the show!

  • 0:59 - Bernard Kerr
  • 5:07 - Loic Bruni
  • 16:14 - Abigail Hogie
  • 25:03 - Jordi Cortes
  • 31:59 - Colin Esquibel
  • 38:43 - Aaron Gwin
  • 44:10 - Wyn Masters
  • 46:31 - Evan Warner
  • 53:00 - Eddie Masters
  • 57:21 - Jorge Gomes
  • 1:03:10 - Nina Hoffmann
  • 1:06:13 - Sian A'hern
  • 1:09:02 - Danny Hart
  • 1:13:07 - Mikayla Parton
  • 1:14:35 - Chris Grice
  • 1:18:46 - Jim Bland
  • 1:21:07 - Austin Dooley
  • 1:24:29 - Tyler Ervin
  • 1:27:30 - Dave Richards
 

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Bernard Kerr
Bernard Kerr
Loic Bruni
Loic Bruni
Abigail Hogie
Abigail Hogie
Jordie Cortes
Jordie Cortes
Colin Esquibel
Colin Esquibel
Aaron Gwin
Aaron Gwin
Evan Warner
Evan Warner
Jorge Gomes
Jorge Gomes
Nina Hoffmann
Nina Hoffmann
Danny Hart
Danny Hart
Chris Grice
Chris Grice
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Austin Dooley
Austin Dooley
Tyler Ervin
Tyler Ervin
Dave Richards
Dave Richards

 

Related:
The Inside Line
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UCI Mountain Bike World Cup
Downhill
26 comments

View replies to: A Year Later, Is World Cup Downhill Racing Better?

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maximumradness
6 months ago

Finally got to watch/listen to this.

i gotta say that if racers want more prize money, and more control over the decisions, they are gonna have to unionize or something like that.

or go to a better series, which i have to feel like any day someone is gonna put together. Even these feeder series they keep talking about, could potentially have better tv coverage (the organizers hire a bad ass film team that puts eso to shame?) or better tracks ( ixs goes to longer tracks?) 

this at the least is gonna be fun to watch unfold….. because many parts of current WC racing are simply not sustainable economically.

it does appear that the “product” is going to be built by tv companies into a “tv” product.

Which kinda bums me out, and also makes ME want to start a high quality “feeder” series for the western usa…… 

cuz its been time……

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Farmergilles
7 months ago

please do a polling on Semi.

It is a professional sport and I agree on rider perspective and risk for not much. Semi should go

from a spectator perspective it is just that the apps of GCN+ suck but I have no concern if quality and money for my sport is the goal.

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Headshot
7 months ago

The season as a whole was very good but the coverage and overall package just lacked the lovely feel that the RBTV show used to have. For me the worst part by far was the commentary.  The repetitive reference to speed and heart rate of the riders is irritating.  CG is no Rob Warner and Rick is not much better. I watched some races with the sound turned down and music on the hifi. Gwin saved the last two races but still had to battle the inane interruptions of Rick and CG. 

Camera work was dismal at times. At MSA they insisted on zooming into riders approaching the main rock garden challenge and failed to zoom out to show the entire bike hitting the first section. Lower down the opposite applied at the huck/drop which was way too zoomed out. Bizarre filming errors by a supposedly professional crew. 

Bernard Kerr's comments ring true to me. Steep increases in costs and entry fees and p$ss poor prize money. No wonder he says riders are being exploited. The risk of cutting rider numbers to deny up and coming talent the chance to compete and improve is also a worry. The UCI and WBD need to hear from the riders and team managers and be told in no uncertain terms what they can and cannot do. I also agree that there is too much racing. The semi- is a bad idea full stop. Qualifying and finals is more than enough for the riders and the viewer. 

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bricelang
7 months ago

I should have plunked down the money for the subscription sooner. I missed most of the season. I caught the last four world cups. If you claim to be a true fan then $8 or 9 a month really isn't that bad. I just pay monthly during the racing season and cancel during the winter. I think the camera coverage is fine. The drone shots have been hit or miss. The commentators are just not good enough. Aaron Gwin was a godsend. We need more commentators like him. I feel strongly that the semifinals need to go. I don't care to watch them. It waters down the main event and exposes the riders to more injuries. I do think we get this train back on track with a few tweaks. There were growing pains this year but they can figure it out.   

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Muggsly
7 months ago

I pay for MotoGP, WSBK, and now DH and I am ok with it since it was $8 a month which is less than I spend on nearly anything else in my life. I picked it up just because I love the racing and I cancelled right at MSA and will pick it up again next year.  I would prefer it to be free for sure but I love the sport and I want to watch the races.  That being said Discovery just did a shit job with Video production and overall it was a shit experience.  The racing was amazing everything else was shit imo. 

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Nzdinosaur
7 months ago

I really enjoyed the whole season.

Apart from missing a few on screen graphics (did redbull have the ip on this?) I've preferred watching this season.

Biggest complaint is there's so much to watch!

Sure the commentary isnt 100% but it took Warner et al 5 years or so before it was "good".

Having juniors televised for free is freaking awesome. We're now watching and talking about riders before they hit elite.

The semi is great, really shaken up the pot. Makes you wonder if the past few years protected riders were always on the stream because of their silver and blue helmets? 

7 different winners in 8 rounds!!

And the gcn+ sub is actually pretty good. There's loads of content on there which is great if you're into more than just dhi.

Personally can't wait until 2024

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LLLLL
7 months ago

sounds like Warner bros need to hire the super Mtb powers of Martin Whitley 

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notthatbryan
7 months ago

Racing was excellent, but that was inspite of ESO's fuckery. 

Commentary was atrocious to the point of detracting from the racing. 

Coverage was worse. There MIGHT have been more complete coverage of race runs, IF you don't mind the shakey, low resolution, drone footage, that often cut out large parts of the rider / bike, and you don't count all the times coverage cut away from a run to show a team Manager. 

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veefour
7 months ago

Listening to Bruni's comments this year I've found him very self centred and selective in his opinions. He's talked about the disadvantage of starting last and having to ride a deteriorated track, whilst ignoring how it can sometimes be an advantage (he arguably had better conditions than riders who went earlier at both Loudenvielle and MSA ). Saying Jackson has an advantage because of his weight and being less prone to flats, even though he flatted the previous round and Bruni didn't (I may be wrong, but I don't remember Bruni flatting in a finals run all season). Being heavier is also definitely an advantage on some tracks.

As far as his comments on Privateers, maybe if he'd had to do the privateer thing at some point in his career, like some of his competitors who are now on teams and competing at his level, he might have a bit more empathy. It also ignores some of the great stories around privateers, look at Dylan Maples this year. The stark difference in attitudes between him and Bernard really stood out. Bernard recognises it's not always about money and considers the good of the sport, where as it sounded like Bruni's earning potential was all Bruni was focussed on. 

Last season he sat with Finn and talked about a need for a rider's union, but this year it just sounds like he wants it all to go his way.

Good luck with viewership increasing to the point where rider's will see the benefit, it's a niche sport and most mountain bikers I know don't follow it, let alone cyclists from other disciplines or the general public. Discovery will worry much more about their shareholder dividend than rewarding the riders. Trickle down economics don't work.

Abigail's comment about the film crews having to work 14 hour days for no extra money tells us all we need to know about Discovery/ESO's attitude to anyone but themselves, pure greed. Their reluctance to tell people (as Jordie, Colin and Evan point out, not just the teams) what's going on sucks and will only be detrimental. If teams and support crews start pulling out due to increased expense and poor organisation how is that going to grow the sport?

From word go Discovery has made a lot of noise about improving things and taking them to the next level. I think we're seeing a bit more of rider's runs, but outside that I would say things are considerably worse, not better. I've never heard so much dissatisfaction from riders in all the years I've been following the sport. Relying on riders being injured to bring commentary up to a decent level shows how amateur the organisation is.

The racing this year has been phenomenal, but that's despite Discovery/ESO's involvement, not because of it.

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astrizzle
7 months ago

Great podcast to get everyone's opinion on how this year went! It's funny to me to hear how political some of the riders are and how media trained some of them are on what they can and can't say. I know you'll never get a true honest opinion from them because of potential sponsor backlashing but this podcast came pretty darn close I think. 

How about this as some proposed changes to the schedule: 

-Run qualifiers on Friday and take the top 40 men/25 women into the final on Sunday 

-Change the current Saturday semifinal race into a Last Chance Qualifier "LCQ" where the #41-#80 finishers from qualifiers get another chance to make it in.

-Take the top 3-5 riders from this LCQ to move on to Sunday which can do 2 big things for riders:

1. Allow for any of the top riders that had a crash or mechanical in the Qualifier race to get into finals 

2. Gives those up and coming privateer riders another chance to achieve their dreams of making it into the final by putting together an all out run.

-Replace Cedric with Gwin in the commentary booth somehow pretty please, Cedric is a great rider and personality in the sport but I just don't think his true calling is in the commentary booth. 

-Pay the riders a descent prize purse or give them free entry into the races or something, I mean you need them to be there in order to hold the race in the first place right? 

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freebiker
7 months ago

The commentary has gotten really good this year.   Just miss Lauren Smith!

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Oz_Taylor
7 months ago

Bruni's been drinking the kool-aid. Who is going to fund these 'awesome' feeder series for riders 51 to 400...the UCI? They don't even offer decent prize money at World Cup level. It's very different in France. MTB is very well funded, thanks to the legacy of Vouilloz where the French federation foot the bill and even national dh races are on terrestrial tv. It's part of the reason why the French are so successful in DH.

The broadcast has been worse than what we got for free from RedBull. Yes I know they sell drinks, but we didn't have to buy those. The races with Aaron have been better. He has lifted the quality of the commentary, which otherwise has been very average. Love Cedric as a rider and personality, but I don't enjoy listening to him commentate in English. I had enough of Ric by the end of the season too. I think the Kate Mason has been good, she brings a level of professionalism to the live show and shows a genuine enthusiasm for the sport. Bring back Warner and Elliot. Please. 

Riders who wear the team manager hat like BK seem to have the best insight. He can see both angles, including the finances. I wonder if Loic is aware of how much it costs to operate a team like Specialized Gravity? 

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Highcountrydh4
7 months ago

Kate Mason good? She spent the last broadcast telling Gwin and Myriam they were old , and previously in the year said she was “risking life and limb” by commenting on the race in the rain. Even my 7 yr old can’t stand her…

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Oz_Taylor
7 months ago

Ha ha fair enough. I just think it's interesting how as an 'outsider', she seems to have really gotten into the spirit of downhill as the season has progressed. I think she is good anchor, and I know that my non-mtb friends seem to appreciate the more entry level questions she asks.  

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Uncle Cliffy
7 months ago

While I see your point of view, wasn’t RedBull getting everything paid? The sport grew during their tenure, the coverage was arguably great by comparison, and it was free for the fans.

Neither of us know how or where the money went, but it seems to me the UCI just wants to expand their portfolios by making us pay. I still need to listen to the podcast. Does it explain?

I’d really love to see the viewership and financial numbers comparison of this year vs. last year…

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notthatbryan
7 months ago

ESO doubled team fees and stuck finals behind a paid subscription (cable or app) and it appears that ZERO of that money made it's way to riders, teams, or organizers other than ESO. 

Restricting the viewership of a niche sport will only make it less visible and therefore less valuable to sponsors. IIRC (I think it was a German MTB mag article) the viewership/retention numbers on Eurosport were bad. So being on TV in Europe is not creating new fans. 

ESO stated they want to bring in outside sponsorship, but their actions so far make that less likely than it was under Red Bull. 

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DBone95
7 months ago

Personally, if I were the World Cup King and could make the decisions, I would:

1) Eliminate semi finals immediately. 60 men and 30 women eligible to try and qualify for the finals (how eligibility is determined not yet decided) 

2) Finals only racing, with 45 men and 20 women

3) The live finals would have the following:

For the men, riders 45-30 would be released every 45 seconds, riders 29-16 released every 90 seconds and riders 15-1 would only be released when the previous rider crosses the finish line (or pulls off the track) so we could see every single second of every run of the top riders.  

For the women, riders 20-16 released every 45 seconds, riders 15-11 released every 90 seconds and riders 10-1 would only be released when the previous rider crosses the finish line (or pulls off the track) so we could see every single second of every run of the top riders.

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